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Tell HN: Employers are not desperate to hire developers

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Re: Tell HN: Employers are not desperate to hire developers

#231

Post by [deleted] »

giantg2 wrote: post #216
chrisseaton wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you’re a FAANG level developer (very top of your field) then surely you’ve got a network of people you can ask for a job anytime rather than having to apply as normal? I’m not even remotely FAANG level but if I wanted a job I’d email some people I know or Tweet that I’m looking - not fill in a form. Have you tried working your network? Emailing some friends?

I hate that there's so much talk about networks. There's a ton of talk about anti-discrimination, equity/equality, etc in other areas of HN. What's the word for cronyism if the person is qualified?

[deleted]

Re: Tell HN: Employers are not desperate to hire developers

#232

Post by giantg2 »

clumsysmurf wrote: post #159
neilv wrote: post #119

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> We need a more precise word than "hiring". I think it's precise. Two terms: * Hiring -- When you are actually ready to make offers to hire people. * Pretending -- When you are trying to keep the hiring funnel full, or to give the appearance of business doing well, but not ready to actually make offers.

Another way I have heard this is described is, "we're always hiring, and never hiring"

Schrodinger's job opening

Re: Tell HN: Employers are not desperate to hire developers

#233

Post by dariusj18 »

mxuribe wrote: post #53
dariusj18 wrote: post #28

My experience is it's impossible to find people who's experience actually matches their resume.

I've heard this so many times....But, i believe that there is always the possibility that someone who is not a perfect match can evolve and learn to become the perfect match. I've also seen the case - though rare - where the "perfect candidate" fails to evolve to learn new things, or fails to adapt to new conditions because they're too intsrested in only a specific scenario. I've been on both the candidate side as we…

That is the case when hiring entry level and junior, but a senior level should be able to hit the ground running on at least one part of the job requirement.

Re: Tell HN: Employers are not desperate to hire developers

#234

Post by giantg2 »

layer8 wrote: post #200
yamtaddle wrote: post #192

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have a relative who's quite accomplished in HR and recruiting and, can confirm, they don't encourage outright lying but they do insist you have to stretch everything to the max and freely imply a lot more than a very honest person might be inclined to. Judging from the results for people I know who've had this person re-work their résumés, it's extremely good advice. Non-braggy résumés seem to just get round-filed fo…

> Non-braggy résumés seem to just get round-filed for not knowing how to play the game That doesn’t make sense, there must be a different causality.

I can say that I have generally been a modest person who has performed well in the past.

The squeaky wheel gets the grease.

People can have fewer accomplishments and make a big deal out of them and get more out of it. I would rather not make a big deal out of meaningless stuff. I recently certified as an AWS practicioner after my associate level certs expired. My manager wants to send an email out to the department about that accomplishment. I don't get it - it's just practicioner.

Re: Tell HN: Employers are not desperate to hire developers

#235

Post by chrisseaton »

giantg2 wrote: post #216
chrisseaton wrote: post #210

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you’re a FAANG level developer (very top of your field) then surely you’ve got a network of people you can ask for a job anytime rather than having to apply as normal? I’m not even remotely FAANG level but if I wanted a job I’d email some people I know or Tweet that I’m looking - not fill in a form. Have you tried working your network? Emailing some friends?

I hate that there's so much talk about networks. There's a ton of talk about anti-discrimination, equity/equality, etc in other areas of HN. What's the word for cronyism if the person is qualified?

It’s not cronyism - it’s people knowing your portfolio of work and abilities.

And at the end of the day - do whatever you need to within reason to put food on your own table. Don’t worry about someone else judging you for cronyism for feeding your family.

Re: Tell HN: Employers are not desperate to hire developers

#236

Post by giantg2 »

devoutsalsa wrote: post #155
guessmyname wrote: post #33

I work at Apple and my team has been “hiring” for the last 2 years with no offers so far. Why? Because even if you are a good candidate, hiring is not as easy as people think. Among the many challengues we have I can list the following: 1. The people interested in your profile have minimal influence in the process, 2. There are people who are always chasing for the shiny new object (or person, in this case), 3. There…

This team is not hiring, or at least not taking it seriously. The bar is not high, it's just petty. The only explanation is that you literally need something that only a handful of people can do, in which case you wouldn't be talking to that many people.

And yet if op says this to management/HR, he would be the one looking for a job.

Re: Tell HN: Employers are not desperate to hire developers

#237

Post by ketralnis »

guessmyname wrote: post #33

I work at Apple and my team has been “hiring” for the last 2 years with no offers so far. Why? Because even if you are a good candidate, hiring is not as easy as people think. Among the many challengues we have I can list the following: 1. The people interested in your profile have minimal influence in the process, 2. There are people who are always chasing for the shiny new object (or person, in this case), 3. There…

I can confirm the time taken, negotiations, and HR interference at Apple. They took about 6 months to get me through their process, by which time my current company gave me the promotion that I was trying to get by moving companies in the first place. (Really a lateral move but to me it was a promotion.)

Re: Tell HN: Employers are not desperate to hire developers

#238

Post by theonething »

educaysean wrote: post #221
bityard wrote: post #137

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> To add to your point about resumes, people need to not underestimate the power of networking. Networking has been the key factor to my advancement for the last 3 jobs. It's just the way things are. It's hard to overstate the importance of this. Without networking, your chances of landing the kind of job you _really_ want are vanishingly close to zero. Every single one of my civilian jobs has come about either throu…

> Without networking, your chances of landing the kind of job you _really_ want are vanishingly close to zero Just to offer an anecdotal counterpoint: I switched companies 3 times in the last 4-5 years. Went from enterprise -> local start up -> big tech -> bay area start up. None of those jobs, including the enterprise gig where I got my start, required me to leverage my network. I don't doubt it's much easier when y…

Same experience here. I do have a network, but have never leveraged it. I just apply for jobs I'm interested and I get some of them. I never have to apply for more than 10 - 15 positions to get at least one. I don't have FAANG on my resume, but a string of solid, but not amazing experience.

Re: Tell HN: Employers are not desperate to hire developers

#239

Post by mejutoco »

guessmyname wrote: post #33

I work at Apple and my team has been “hiring” for the last 2 years with no offers so far. Why? Because even if you are a good candidate, hiring is not as easy as people think. Among the many challengues we have I can list the following: 1. The people interested in your profile have minimal influence in the process, 2. There are people who are always chasing for the shiny new object (or person, in this case), 3. There…

> they write over the top accomplishments in their resumes that are hard to believe, at least without proof

Do you ask them for proof or reject them without asking?

Re: Tell HN: Employers are not desperate to hire developers

#240

Post by neon_electro »

dadjoker wrote: post #161

I experienced this same thing in 2020 when I was hunting for my current job. I lost count of how many places I applied to. Over the past year, I have been on the hiring side, and I can offer a few tips as well, based on filtering through many resumes and doing many interviews. 1) Don't list 20 different technologies and claim to be an expert in all of them. There is no way for someone to be a true "expert" in many te…

Do you really think code tests like the ones you mentioned are an effective way to screen candidates? I will outright drop out of consideration for a role if Leetcode is mentioned. I'm not putting up with it.
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