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I'm starting to think LEGO is evil

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Re: I'm starting to think LEGO is evil

#91

Post by jkeel »

My daughter loves legos and seems to really love the Harry Potter legos. I do agree that getting generic legos instead of boy centric seems more challenging but they are out there.

What I really connected with more in this article was the advent calendar with the cops and robbers. My wife told me a while back, "I got this cool lego advent calendar online". I was like, "cool!". Then I saw this cops and robbers theme and I told her, "Is this really what Christmas is about in the US now? Hey kids! Be careful out there as there are people that want to break into your house and steal your stuff!"

I know, I know... If I don't like it then don't buy it. I agree. I still think it's a strange advent calendar even though my son actually likes it.

Re: I'm starting to think LEGO is evil

#92

Post by mvzink »

nostromo wrote: post #53

When I see these stories taking companies to task over why they sell what they do, I always wonder why nobody holds consumers to task. For example: why doesn't Lego sell to girls? Why doesn't Barbie have more realistic features? Why don't car manufacturers offer an electric vehicle? Why doesn't McDonalds sell salads instead of fries? Why do record labels offer such crappy music? It's easy to blame the companies -- bu…

I tend to agree, but there's a missing element in this economic model, though one that others have mentioned (cf. sunahsuh's comment): marketing. If you look at Marx, or even Smith, it's clear that the wants and demands of the consumers are not always organic, but are often fabricated by the companies themselves. Smith thought this was cool, Marx thought it was evil; in any case, you are right to some extent, but few people go out of their way to buy something they haven't been told they want.

Re: I'm starting to think LEGO is evil

#93

Post by pbreit »

maximusprime wrote: post #87
pbreit wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was referring to the broader argument, not just the gender aspect. And, yes, I think people do want change. This is proven by the success of Apple and Pixar who both reject a lot of commercial demands.

Lego Star wars is MASSIVE. It sells by the boat load. Kids lap it up. Same with the other movie tie ins. Why would it not? I play Lego star wars the game, and obviously I now want all the characters in real Lego. Doing movie/character tie ins, gives customers what they want. I was pretty excited to see http://www.legosuperheroes.com/ (Lego are making a new superhero range in January). And for people who don't want th…

Here's the main quote from the post I replied to: "why doesn't Lego sell to girls? Why doesn't Barbie have more realistic features? Why don't car manufacturers offer an electric vehicle? Why doesn't McDonalds sell salads instead of fries? Why do record labels offer such crappy music?"

It references gender once and movie tie-ins not at all.

I actually think movie tie-ins are pretty reasonable especially from one of the best movies ever made (Star Wars, not the pre-quels) as well as some of the best animated story-telling and characters ever made (Pixar).

Re: I'm starting to think LEGO is evil

#94

Post by sunahsuh »

maximusprime wrote: post #70
pbreit wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's much easier for a single company to make some changes than it is for a single or even very large group of consumers to drive a change. It stinks, but every complaint about products asks for an Apple comparison. I would say both Apple and Pixar have demonstrated that sticking to the purity of your craft can be both fulfilling and extremely lucrative.

You assume people want a change. I do not think they do. Do people want an end to gender specific toys? Certainly some do. But the vast majority do not. I firmly believe, through interacting with people in general, and my own children, that female and male brains are completely different. They are hard wired to like different things, and behave differently. I don't see anything wrong with that, and don't see any reas…

I take massive issue with this.

We start the training with regard to gender so early that it's hard to tell what's "nature" and what's "nurture". I'm watching the choices my sister makes during her pregnancy with fascination. Gender is the earliest thing we bombard them with -- painting rooms pink, buying gendered clothes, choosing certain toys.. we don't even thinking about it because it's so normal until, for instance, you make a conscious effort to try and raise your child in a gender neutral environment.

Re: I'm starting to think LEGO is evil

#95

Post by ericabiz »

dmm wrote: post #50
ericabiz wrote: post #35

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Nope, I'm not. I basically really suck at school, and am pretty awesome at computers and making money. That's why I started a startup at age 20 instead of finishing college, then sold it for a nice profit when I was 26. Now I'm on to another startup, and run a popular blog to boot.

Hey that's really cool. I wasn't meaning to be insulting, if that's how you took my comment. I had this awesome dialog planned that would have resulted in deep insight all around but then the comment was downvoted to hell and I became flustered.

Dude, I run a popular blog. I've had every insult imaginable thrown at me. No offense taken. I tend to answer every question in the same dry, blunt manner. ;)

Re: I'm starting to think LEGO is evil

#96

Post by dgabriel »

cschmidt wrote: post #51
dgabriel wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's the hard gender division. Why are there "girl legos," and "boy legos"? And it also seems like they're offering the same "girl themed" play sets that all the other toys offer, except you have to put it together first. Who plays with lego that way?

I think my 4 year old girl is going to greatly prefer their new legos. Right now, she plays with Duplos, and all is well. However, I can see a day when legos are "too boy". That's just what they reported happening in the Lego studies. Duplo works, and then the girls doen't make the transition to regular lego. We have an older boy as well, and so our house has every lego you can imagine, plus lots of really cool vehic…

Interesting. We have a 9yo boy, and twin 2 yo girls. So we have all the lego stuff, plus lego designer on the computer, etc. The girls LOVE getting into their brother's stuff, and one of them sleeps with a toy garbage truck (she also sleeps with a bus pass, a collection of stuffed puppies, and an Olivia board book...) It may be because I'm interested in this stuff, too, because they're too young to have "girl" vs "boy" divisions, or because they're just different. It's hard to tell. I do know that when I was a girl, I loved lego, and had a huge collection of matchbox cars (also my little ponies...).

Re: I'm starting to think LEGO is evil

#97

Post by codemac »

nostromo wrote: post #53

When I see these stories taking companies to task over why they sell what they do, I always wonder why nobody holds consumers to task. For example: why doesn't Lego sell to girls? Why doesn't Barbie have more realistic features? Why don't car manufacturers offer an electric vehicle? Why doesn't McDonalds sell salads instead of fries? Why do record labels offer such crappy music? It's easy to blame the companies -- bu…

I blame companies instead of consumers because they market the shit out this stuff.

No one is born with an innate desire for that specific Barbie or Lego set. The companies market to you, make you feel like you want it. The companies may not be able to change the entire macro environment, but they actively profit and exploit it.

So yea, they are way more to blame than what 11 year old girls think their place in the world is. Who do you think told them?

Re: I'm starting to think LEGO is evil

#98

Post by ericabiz »

DarkShikari wrote: post #60
ericabiz wrote: post #3

As a girl geek who grew up on Legos, this makes me really, really sad. From the NPR article linked to from the article above: "Lego also consciously aimed for boy customers when it embarked on its stunning turnaround. Boys were easier to sell to than girls." headsmash "The new Lego girl minifigures have names like Stephanie, Olivia, and Emma, and the building sets include a veterinary clinic, a hairdressing salon, a…

(By the way, if you ever want a conclusive argument that girls being raised to love pink and hate math is societal The most staggering thing about these assumptions is not merely how they contradict current scientific understanding, but they contradict reality . Pink used to be a boys' color: the idea of pink as "girly" didn't exist 100 years ago. Ironically, this commonly-given-example is itself a fantastic example…

Agreed. Thank you for your post! That's basically exactly what the book I recommended says, except she goes into 200+ pages of detail about it (with much supporting evidence.)

Re: I'm starting to think LEGO is evil

#99

Post by amirmc »

amirmc wrote: post #66

It's not Lego that's "highly-problematic". They're simply trying to give the kids(parents?) of today what they want. If you follow the NPR article linked in the article, you'll see that Lego clearly did their homework before embarking on this new line. In light of this, I think it's odd for them to be accused of reinforcing stereotypes when their research showed that this is how (most) girls like to play . I do think…

Just spoke my gf. She's doing grad research on children's play and is actually (partially) funded by Lego. I'll just quote her (but bear in mind that it's a soundbite - there's likely a whole PhD in boy/girl play behaviour).

"Generally speaking, boys will happily construct just for the sake of it and although girls will also build things, for them there's no point if they can't breath life into it."

Re: I'm starting to think LEGO is evil

#100

Post by InclinedPlane »

nostromo wrote: post #53

When I see these stories taking companies to task over why they sell what they do, I always wonder why nobody holds consumers to task. For example: why doesn't Lego sell to girls? Why doesn't Barbie have more realistic features? Why don't car manufacturers offer an electric vehicle? Why doesn't McDonalds sell salads instead of fries? Why do record labels offer such crappy music? It's easy to blame the companies -- bu…

It goes along with the "soft bigotry of low expectations". We've come to a common mental model of the world that disempowers the individual, especially in the realm of responsibilities. The state and the corporation are the sole seats of responsibility and of blame, and thus the sole seats of power.

It's more than a little disturbing to see people willingly disempower themselves in such a fashion for so little in return.

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