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TikTok’s greatest asset isn’t its algorithm, it’s your phone

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Re: TikTok’s greatest asset isn’t its algorithm, it’s your phone

#161

Post by sofixa »

mrweasel wrote: post #118
clement_b wrote: post #115

I think TikTok and similar products are garbage and will lower the average IQ, especially of younger generations. I am deeply concerned when I see kids hooked on that crack, because they are burning their potential. It's scary, and if I had one far fetched easy theory to make, I'd say TikTok is a way for China to mitigate the threat coming from the west's upcoming generations, by ensuring their collective capabilitie…

> What they collect is literally nothing special. For the most part I agree, but it depends on the owner of the phone. Danish politicians have increasingly been using TikTok. It doesn't take a Chinese genius to correlate the location of two or more MPs during the current talks, regarding how to form the next government, to gain insights into how that could possibly pan out. They've basically stuffed a tracking device…

Isn't this one of the reasons why phone permissions (at least on Android) have the option to share location data with an app only when it's in use?

Re: TikTok’s greatest asset isn’t its algorithm, it’s your phone

#162

Post by Gatsky »

sidcool wrote: post #15

Same holds true for Facebook, YouTube and Instagram.

Youtube is different imho. Lots of quality content, long form, carefully crafted. Many popular creators post infrequently. Not free of trash obviously, but qualitatively different to tiktok’s mind hacking. YT also pays creators better AFAIK.

Re: TikTok’s greatest asset isn’t its algorithm, it’s your phone

#163

Post by mnsc »

tluyben2 wrote: post #105
nagonago wrote: post #89

After hearing so much about TikTok's addictiveness, I decided to give it a whirl. I spent a good few hours trying to get a feed that was interesting to me by searching for various keywords. I was mostly looking for weird, abstract, absurdist videos, but also anything else that interested me. Unfortunately it was quite difficult to find anything I actually liked. Most of "weird tiktok" seemed to be a teenager's idea o…

Tried it over the past week. Even about the subjects that interest me, all the vids I could find were too shallow (as in old info, badly researched etc even for such a short video), sensationalist click bait, way too short etc. I filled in my profile honestly and somehow it took me a lot of effort to teach the algo that I don't want to see videos of (mostly) naked teens dancing or doing (other) suggestive sex things…

The app is collecting tons of metrics of actual watching behaviour to adapt the feed. So maybe you don't want to advertise that "after using the app extensively I'm still getting only half naked young girls dancing". I'm not getting any half naked girls dancing in my feed despite quite enjoying young people dancing mindlessly as a counterweight to the state of the fucking world. Eg. the top notch editing/dancing by Cale Brown.

Re: TikTok’s greatest asset isn’t its algorithm, it’s your phone

#164

Post by mjburgess »

roguesherlock wrote: post #111
somenameforme wrote: post #95

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This claim is regularly repeated, but strongly and directly contradicted by literally every study on the topic. Here [1] is one from Pew in late 2019. 81% of Americans believe the potential risks of companies collecting about them outweighs and benefits. 79% are very/somewhat concerned about how the data collected on them is used. The big issue 81% also believe that little or no control over the data collection. Inte…

I hear you. It’s just that the rise of TikTok contradicts all the survey results. I.e. I don’t see their sentiments reflect in their actions. I mean if you’re concerned about your data and feel helpless, simply don’t use the app. But TikTok keeps rising doesn’t it.

This assumes an implausible view of rationality, knowledge and intent.

People who intend action-X do not also intend all the consequences of X, nor are even plausibly aware of what those are. And even when they are, those are often so numerous that a time-bound agent (a person) isnt going to enumerate and weigh each for most actions.

One common case is collective action problems, eg., the tragedy of the commons: by each fishing to their intended amount they harm their ability to fish in the future, which was not intended.

Social media is a very plausible case: by each posting to their intended amount, their create the unintended result of the "gamification & publication of social life as such", and thus harm their future ability to socialise as intended.

Re: TikTok’s greatest asset isn’t its algorithm, it’s your phone

#165

Post by Plyphon_ »

dagenix wrote: post #150
clement_b wrote: post #115

I think TikTok and similar products are garbage and will lower the average IQ, especially of younger generations. I am deeply concerned when I see kids hooked on that crack, because they are burning their potential. It's scary, and if I had one far fetched easy theory to make, I'd say TikTok is a way for China to mitigate the threat coming from the west's upcoming generations, by ensuring their collective capabilitie…

> I think TikTok and similar products are garbage and will lower the average IQ, especially of younger generations. I have lots of concerns about TikTok and refuse to use it myself. But this is ridiculous - and that upsets me quite a bit because is delegitimizes the actual problems with TikTok. TikTok will not lower anyone's IQ. This is straight up just old man yelling at cloud. And that does us all a disservice.

Agreed.

They said that about radio. They said that about TV. They said that about computers. They said that about dumbphones. They said that about smartphones. They're now saying that about apps.

Re: TikTok’s greatest asset isn’t its algorithm, it’s your phone

#166

Post by aaron695 »

jojobas wrote: post #83
phendrenad2 wrote: post #37

There are two types of people: Those who have used TikTok, and those who haven't (but are nevertheless engaged in a full-on satanic panic / red scare over it).

You seem to imply that those who have used TikTok know for a fact it's harmless. It's not, on many levels. At the very least, it encourages harmful behaviours both while using the app (aka mindlessly hollow crap TV couldn't dream of) and off-app (by showing you stupid shit that gets promoted to the top, therefore implicitly approved by society). Curiously, the kind of activities that the "TikTok algorithm" promotes i…

No post body was provided.

Re: TikTok’s greatest asset isn’t its algorithm, it’s your phone

#167

Post by lzooz »

bakuninsbart wrote: post #135
MikePlacid wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> TikTok (Douyin) also operates in China. No kid is spared. Can’t vouch for the following observation, since I’ve never used either one, but: "In their version of TikTok, if you're under 14 years old, they show you science experiments you can do at home, museum exhibits, patriotism videos and educational videos," said Tristan Harris, co-founder of the Center for Humane Technology. "And they also limit it to only 40 m…

When have we ever expected companies to do the right thing? Governments are needed to come up with regulations for that, but restricting which content or how much someone can consume, even kids, would be touted as deeply authoritarian in our societies. So the otus is then on parents...

Yeah, no, I do not want the government rearing children, thanks.

Re: TikTok’s greatest asset isn’t its algorithm, it’s your phone

#168

Post by t20 »

clement_b wrote: post #115

I think TikTok and similar products are garbage and will lower the average IQ, especially of younger generations. I am deeply concerned when I see kids hooked on that crack, because they are burning their potential. It's scary, and if I had one far fetched easy theory to make, I'd say TikTok is a way for China to mitigate the threat coming from the west's upcoming generations, by ensuring their collective capabilitie…

I made an account to reply to this. I don't think this is a China/TikTok issue but more an issue of how the west is treating its people.

Sure, social media/TikTok shows impressionable people that you can earn a (good) living by making content (as does YouTube, Twitch, and OnlyFans). Still, western civilizations aren't offering an attractive alternative.

Look at all the layoffs in tech and all the outsourcing that has happened with companies that earn record profits.

If I were a young kid growing up now, seeing my parents getting laid off for no reason and switching jobs every few years/months, I'd think this might not be how I want to live my life.

As a result, young people grow up chasing careers in content rather than science, infrastructure, tech, or health care because they now know that going down that path opens them up to massive vulnerabilities and possibly a low quality of life. After a couple of generations, there might not be enough people working in those necessary fields, which can hurt.

Re: TikTok’s greatest asset isn’t its algorithm, it’s your phone

#169

Post by lozenge »

asutekku wrote: post #127
MikePlacid wrote: post #123

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> TikTok (Douyin) also operates in China. No kid is spared. Can’t vouch for the following observation, since I’ve never used either one, but: "In their version of TikTok, if you're under 14 years old, they show you science experiments you can do at home, museum exhibits, patriotism videos and educational videos," said Tristan Harris, co-founder of the Center for Humane Technology. "And they also limit it to only 40 m…

Any kind of amusing content for kids is time restricted in china. If a western game company wants to get into the market, they need to implement time limits & age checks.

Are they linked at all? Otherwise if you add up all the time limits they must exceed a day...

Re: TikTok’s greatest asset isn’t its algorithm, it’s your phone

#170

Post by probably_wrong »

mnsc wrote: post #163
tluyben2 wrote: post #105

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Tried it over the past week. Even about the subjects that interest me, all the vids I could find were too shallow (as in old info, badly researched etc even for such a short video), sensationalist click bait, way too short etc. I filled in my profile honestly and somehow it took me a lot of effort to teach the algo that I don't want to see videos of (mostly) naked teens dancing or doing (other) suggestive sex things…

The app is collecting tons of metrics of actual watching behaviour to adapt the feed. So maybe you don't want to advertise that "after using the app extensively I'm still getting only half naked young girls dancing". I'm not getting any half naked girls dancing in my feed despite quite enjoying young people dancing mindlessly as a counterweight to the state of the fucking world. Eg. the top notch editing/dancing by C…

I'm sorry to say that your comment is the type of comment I'd typically downvote, but there's something about it that I think is worth discussing.

The user is complaining that he cannot get rid of the half-naked young girls dancing no matter how hard he tries. And yet, your reply is to accuse them of it being somehow their fault? If this is not Thoughtcrime, I don't know what it is.

For the record, I have heard this complaint before. I assume it's the default algorithm response when it can't figure you out.

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