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I am tired of hearing banalities about remote working

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Re: I am tired of hearing banalities about remote working

#21

Post by klyrs »

bsder wrote: post #19
bvanderveen wrote: post #5

Is there an official party line that wfh is in every way for every person everywhere always better, and it’s best not to kick that hornet’s nest? Asking for a friend.

If you have 3 roommates who are also WFH, is WFH better for all of you? Part of the reason why WFH seems so much better is that companies made working in the office so horrible . Anyone who promulgated open floor plans should have been summarily fired. Alas. Here we are.

Add zoom meetings and dogs to the open floor plan, and the office is a terrible place to get anything done.

Re: I am tired of hearing banalities about remote working

#22

Post by kaashif »

klyrs wrote: post #21
bsder wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If you have 3 roommates who are also WFH, is WFH better for all of you? Part of the reason why WFH seems so much better is that companies made working in the office so horrible . Anyone who promulgated open floor plans should have been summarily fired. Alas. Here we are.

Add zoom meetings and dogs to the open floor plan, and the office is a terrible place to get anything done.

Dogs? What? I still find it insane that any workplace allows non-service dogs and even more bizarrely, some recruiters list "dog-friendly" as a perk.

Crazy.

Re: I am tired of hearing banalities about remote working

#23

Post by throwaway22032 »

coldtea wrote: post #12
bvanderveen wrote: post #5

Is there an official party line that wfh is in every way for every person everywhere always better, and it’s best not to kick that hornet’s nest? Asking for a friend.

The option to WFH, and avoid commuting, congestion, pollution, higher costs, disruptions, be closer to your spouse/kids, and don't lose an additional 2 hours every day is indeed inherently better for anyone, everywhere. If someone likes socializing, they can do more of that when WFH too (especially since WFH really means: working from anywhere, be it a cafe, a coworking space, a village, or wherever they like). Excep…

You've described a bunch of specific constraints that don't apply to "anyone, everywhere".

None of those items apply to me. It doesn't cost me anything to go into the office, it doesn't take hours, there's no pollution involved (at least, none over just the base rate of me being outside).

The idea that not wanting to spend every day Mon-Fri constantly around my SO means I have "issues at home" I can only really imagine is projection.

I don't particularly care if you like WFH, but pretending no-one actually likes working in person is denial of reality. Hi, I exist.

Re: I am tired of hearing banalities about remote working

#24

Post by throwaway22032 »

yrgulation wrote: post #15

Those who advocate for on site work are like people of the old age that advocated for in store shopping. They thought no one would ever shop online because they’d need to touch and feel the products before buying. Same kind of people who thought blockbuster is better than netflix because people want the experience. The reality tho is the world is changing and so is how we work in it.

How is in store shopping "of the old age"? Do you ever go outside...?

Re: I am tired of hearing banalities about remote working

#25

Post by PenguinCoder »

throwaway22032 wrote: post #23
coldtea wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The option to WFH, and avoid commuting, congestion, pollution, higher costs, disruptions, be closer to your spouse/kids, and don't lose an additional 2 hours every day is indeed inherently better for anyone, everywhere. If someone likes socializing, they can do more of that when WFH too (especially since WFH really means: working from anywhere, be it a cafe, a coworking space, a village, or wherever they like). Excep…

You've described a bunch of specific constraints that don't apply to "anyone, everywhere". None of those items apply to me. It doesn't cost me anything to go into the office, it doesn't take hours, there's no pollution involved (at least, none over just the base rate of me being outside). The idea that not wanting to spend every day Mon-Fri constantly around my SO means I have "issues at home" I can only really imagi…

I don't particularly care if you like working in an office, but pretending everyone likes working in person, in a shared office, is a denial of reality.

People who do better at WFH have had to put up with and deal with the "butts in seat" work mentality for decades, even after remote work has been a possibility, especially in tech. Not everyone wants to be in an office, not everyone wants to be WFH. We shouldn't be forcing people to do either, if they don't want. Choice would be nice, but I'm way beyond dealing with being forced to come into an office as an employment requirement too.

Re: I am tired of hearing banalities about remote working

#26

Post by throwaway22032 »

PenguinCoder wrote: post #25
throwaway22032 wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You've described a bunch of specific constraints that don't apply to "anyone, everywhere". None of those items apply to me. It doesn't cost me anything to go into the office, it doesn't take hours, there's no pollution involved (at least, none over just the base rate of me being outside). The idea that not wanting to spend every day Mon-Fri constantly around my SO means I have "issues at home" I can only really imagi…

I don't particularly care if you like working in an office, but pretending everyone likes working in person, in a shared office, is a denial of reality. People who do better at WFH have had to put up with and deal with the "butts in seat" work mentality for decades, even after remote work has been a possibility, especially in tech. Not everyone wants to be in an office, not everyone wants to be WFH. We shouldn't be f…

Some jobs require employees to work in person, some jobs require them to work from home.

There is no force involved, that's hyperbolic.

I'm not aware of anyone arguing that everyone enjoys working in person. That would be daft. The existence of this thread disproves that.

Re: I am tired of hearing banalities about remote working

#27

Post by krashidov »

compiler-devel wrote: post #18
coldtea wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The option to WFH, and avoid commuting, congestion, pollution, higher costs, disruptions, be closer to your spouse/kids, and don't lose an additional 2 hours every day is indeed inherently better for anyone, everywhere. If someone likes socializing, they can do more of that when WFH too (especially since WFH really means: working from anywhere, be it a cafe, a coworking space, a village, or wherever they like). Excep…

From an environmental impact perspective alone, the opportunity to free the planet from emissions, lower the demand for vehicles, improve pedestrian safety by staying off the road, and lower commute-induced stressors on our bodies should be enough of a reason to WFH whenever possible. And those are only the first benefits of the practice.

You are conflating automobile transport with working from an office. They are different issues.

Re: I am tired of hearing banalities about remote working

#28

Post by dogcatter »

compiler-devel wrote: post #18
coldtea wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The option to WFH, and avoid commuting, congestion, pollution, higher costs, disruptions, be closer to your spouse/kids, and don't lose an additional 2 hours every day is indeed inherently better for anyone, everywhere. If someone likes socializing, they can do more of that when WFH too (especially since WFH really means: working from anywhere, be it a cafe, a coworking space, a village, or wherever they like). Excep…

From an environmental impact perspective alone, the opportunity to free the planet from emissions, lower the demand for vehicles, improve pedestrian safety by staying off the road, and lower commute-induced stressors on our bodies should be enough of a reason to WFH whenever possible. And those are only the first benefits of the practice.

The emissions impact of WFH is far from clear actually. In many cases lots of people staying home running their domestic heating and cooking etc systems consumes more energy than them using the big efficient industrial ones at the office, enough to outweigh transport emissions. (Especially since the industrial ones are still running in many cases, because people still come in a few days a week.)

Re: I am tired of hearing banalities about remote working

#29

Post by hulitu »

yrgulation wrote: post #15

Those who advocate for on site work are like people of the old age that advocated for in store shopping. They thought no one would ever shop online because they’d need to touch and feel the products before buying. Same kind of people who thought blockbuster is better than netflix because people want the experience. The reality tho is the world is changing and so is how we work in it.

I don't know what netflix you have but on mine Star trek looks horrible and the sound is so bad that i have to turn the volume to 70% to be able to distinguish what people speak. Online shopping is nice until you realize that the piece of clothing you bought is total crap and it does not resemble the picture on the website. And not everybody has time to spend at the Post office shipping back parcels.

Re: I am tired of hearing banalities about remote working

#30

Post by coldtea »

throwaway22032 wrote: post #23
coldtea wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The option to WFH, and avoid commuting, congestion, pollution, higher costs, disruptions, be closer to your spouse/kids, and don't lose an additional 2 hours every day is indeed inherently better for anyone, everywhere. If someone likes socializing, they can do more of that when WFH too (especially since WFH really means: working from anywhere, be it a cafe, a coworking space, a village, or wherever they like). Excep…

You've described a bunch of specific constraints that don't apply to "anyone, everywhere". None of those items apply to me. It doesn't cost me anything to go into the office, it doesn't take hours, there's no pollution involved (at least, none over just the base rate of me being outside). The idea that not wanting to spend every day Mon-Fri constantly around my SO means I have "issues at home" I can only really imagi…

>None of those items apply to me. It doesn't cost me anything to go into the office, it doesn't take hours, there's no pollution involved (at least, none over just the base rate of me being outside).

Then you already WFH, or from "next door to home".

What's more, you're an exception, in a world with billions of commuters.

>*The idea that not wanting to spend every day Mon-Fri constantly around my SO means I have "issues at home" I can only really imagine is projection. (...) but pretending no-one actually likes working in person is denial of reality. Hi, I exist."

Again, not everything is about you. For some people WFH is bad because of a bad home environment. In good home environments, the ability to spend more time with kids/spouse is a good thing.

Note also how nothing about WFH means that you need to work from your actual home, or that you need to spend "every day Mon-Fri constantly around your SO".

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