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Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

ec.europa.eu

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Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#141

Post by psychoslave »

ajsnigrutin wrote: post #137
psychoslave wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The question for you is whether the government has a need or the right to know every penny (or whatever fractional currency you can legally use) that you move around. First, there is nothing like the government in Europe. Secondly, the organisms that are tracking as extensively as possible European citizen are mostly private firms (whose parent companies are typically not European). European directives like GPDR ar…

> First, there is nothing like the government in Europe. technically no... but in practice, yes. EU decides something, and local governments must implement the EU-wide changes into local laws. If EU decides to do something, they do it... the states are not as sovereign as it might seem. I mean... look at EU banning RT (dot com) - https://www.consilium.europa.eu/en/press/press-releases/2022... EU decided to identify p…

>EU decides something, and local governments must implement the EU-wide changes into local laws.

The thing is, "EU decides" hides all the complexity of the reality. First of all, "Europe Union" can refer to many things. Here, most likely the sentence refers to the European Parliament. European Commission, European Council, euro area are three other distinct notions for example that can be easily confused with EU.

>the states are not as sovereign as it might seem.

They prioritize their sovereign decision power on staying unified above local punctual interests… or not, as the Brexit showed. States, so far, remain sovereign, even if they accept to bow before collegial decisions in which they themselves participate.

European Council is the institution that is generally presented as "the government".

Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#142

Post by Goz3rr »

fy20 wrote: post #119
Goz3rr wrote: post #9

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's basically a SEPA transfer as they already exist, except instant. I'm not sure how Poland would fit into this exactly as the press release specifically mentions payments in euro, not zloty. Dutch banks have supported instant payments for a couple of years now, and the way person to person payments are most often done is through something called a "Tikkie" which involves sending someone a payment URL (via any mess…

I guess the idea is to have a unified system throughout the EU, so if you are from Germany and you are on holiday in Portugal, you can still do instant transfers to pay in shops.

But why would you pay by bank transfer? Why not pay (contactless) with your phone/wearable/regular card?

Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#143

Post by AlbertoGP »

LargoLasskhyfv wrote: post #21

Hrr Hrr. Meanwhile, Deutsche Postbank ATM (because Cashgroup), 3rd time in a row of three months, at the beginning of a month in the late evening: This Service is currently not available. In different locations. Deutsche Bank has no open ATM locations at late evening or night anymore. While Shell does it. They make cash suck more and more. Grr!

Same here (Saarland): tried finding an ATM, went to two different places, both were out of order in the same day!

Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#144

Post by rocketbop »

CoUHKT57BSe wrote: post #112
em500 wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1. With bank details I mean name+act number. Of course we are also being told not to share login details etc. But here in the Netherlands tiny businesses and individuals do not hesitate giving you their account number if they expect payments from you. Giving your bank account was the defacto way to receive payments before moving to instant payment links. It still is for most businesses, even tiny ones like farmers an…

Yes I understand what everyone is saying, that giving out the account number is not dangerous in itself and that businesses all over the world do it so they can accept payments, but generally the advice given to individuals is not to give out those details to random strangers (not because they can then take money out of it, but more likely use it for further phishing or whatever). My only point was that the message I…

Irish here and I can't recall ever hearing that advice... I can remember banks saying things like that they'll never ask you for your pin number.

Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#145

Post by themitigating »

saiya-jin wrote: post #46
themitigating wrote: post #39

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Can you provide an example?

Exactly as parent mentioned - in China, if you mess with Party or they just deem you undesirable for whatever reason ie ethnicity, you can't purchase plane tickets, not even domestic ones. Heck, not even trains so you can't effectively travel within China. No mortgages/loans. Of course it will affect your hiring options badly. I believe it goes way deeper. China is already 1984 for a decade+

That's not an example, I want a specific example

Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#146

Post by CoUHKT57BSe »

rocketbop wrote: post #144
CoUHKT57BSe wrote: post #112

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes I understand what everyone is saying, that giving out the account number is not dangerous in itself and that businesses all over the world do it so they can accept payments, but generally the advice given to individuals is not to give out those details to random strangers (not because they can then take money out of it, but more likely use it for further phishing or whatever). My only point was that the message I…

Irish here and I can't recall ever hearing that advice... I can remember banks saying things like that they'll never ask you for your pin number.

Fine, here is a direct example, from the Bank of Ireland security website: https://www.bankofireland.com/security-zone/fraudster-tactic... "They may claim that your account has been compromised and ask you for your bank card or bank account details"

The GENERAL (I will super emphasize this word this time - G.E.N.E.R.A.L) advice from financial institutions for a very long time has been that scammers want your personal information, so to stay safe you should not give bank info to strangers. They also reccommend avoiding bank transfers, money grams and other such things and only using secure card payments.

Again, this is GENERAL advice, if someone wants someone else to send them money they can of course give them their account number and get the money transfered, I never said there was anything wrong with bank transfers, just that the GENERAL advice is to avoid them, they are often associated with scammers.

There was a prank call show on tv about 10 years ago called fonejacker (UK tv) and one of the characters used to ring people up and ask for their bank account details (example sketch here https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=LA3zhzT1wDo ) and funnily enough, no one that I recall ever gave them out.

If 2 people want to make a transaction via bank transfer they can, but the GENERAL advice has always been to avoid them and don't be handing out bank details to strangers. Obviously, "dont give bank details to strangers" is not an exact quote from a financial institution, it is just the GENERAL theme of the overall advice to avoid being scammed.

Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#147

Post by f6v »

ajsnigrutin wrote: post #51
f6v wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t see an issue. The government already knows how much I earn, where I live, etc.

Oh, you bought booze and chocolates yesterday? You're getting fat and drunk, your health insurance just went up. Oh, you made an inapropriate comment on twitter... no more concerts and movie tickets for you. As said by someone else below, china has a similar system in place, where chinese people with low social scores cannot buy public transportation tickets. And I also don't think the government needs to know you we…

> Oh, you bought booze and chocolates yesterday? You're getting fat and drunk, your health insurance just went up

I mean, you’re exaggerating. But yes, I’d like obese people to pay more for insurance. Also, if government thinks booze is bad it shouldn’t sell it.

> As said by someone else below, china has a similar system in place

Anecdotally, I asked about this a Chinese friend I studied with in Europe. She said “Social credit? What’s that?” It’s not that she can’t read, she’s on Instagram and WhatsApp.

Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#148

Post by LargoLasskhyfv »

AlbertoGP wrote: post #143
LargoLasskhyfv wrote: post #21

Hrr Hrr. Meanwhile, Deutsche Postbank ATM (because Cashgroup), 3rd time in a row of three months, at the beginning of a month in the late evening: This Service is currently not available. In different locations. Deutsche Bank has no open ATM locations at late evening or night anymore. While Shell does it. They make cash suck more and more. Grr!

Same here (Saarland): tried finding an ATM, went to two different places, both were out of order in the same day!

Do you know https://www.cashgroup.de/ btw.?

This map is my pet peeve. Because after you've entered your PLZ/Zip or address, it doesn't even show all ATMs. You have to 'wiggle' the map a little, then others pop up. And depending on how you zoom in, they disappear again. Have to 're-wiggle' carefully. If you pan far, it takes time for the ATMs in that area to pop up, if at all. Again, 'wiggling' is needed.

And it still doesn't show one who I pass by often, know it's in operation, but is useless anyways, because: Dieser Service ist derzeit nicht verfügbar.

ARRGH! Trashgroup!

Edit: On FF with uBo off btw., just to be sure.

Edit: Can't get over it. There is one Bank next to my now closed Bank which had an ATM, which now has a sign to use the next one from Postbank, which doesn't even show up on their map, and which gives you the No Service message regardless.

Re: Commission proposes to accelerate the rollout of instant payments in euro

#149

Post by AlbertoGP »

LargoLasskhyfv wrote: post #148
AlbertoGP wrote: post #143

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Same here (Saarland): tried finding an ATM, went to two different places, both were out of order in the same day!

Do you know https://www.cashgroup.de/ btw.? This map is my pet peeve. Because after you've entered your PLZ/Zip or address, it doesn't even show all ATMs. You have to 'wiggle' the map a little, then others pop up. And depending on how you zoom in, they disappear again. Have to 're-wiggle' carefully. If you pan far, it takes time for the ATMs in that area to pop up, if at all. Again, 'wiggling' is needed. And it still…

Wow, did not know about that website, and sure enough, it does show the two ATMs that were out of service. I doubt they are back.

It makes a great impression right from the start with the comically squashed map of Germany: the aspect ratio depends on the window size.

Thank you very much for your report. It’s good to know that these are not isolated incidents.

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