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FBI: Carrier IQ files used for "law enforcement purposes"

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Re: FBI: Carrier IQ files used for "law enforcement purposes"

#31

Post by biff »

pyre wrote: post #21
smokeyj wrote: post #9

A profile is being generated about you, slowly but surely. It starts out as a vague picture, but the more you communicate, the the more clearly you define yourself. It includes your political affiliations, interests you display online, who your friends are, your every movement, your sexual preferences, close secrets, and anything else that can be gathered about you. These profiles are stored in a government database…

... And you can't 'escape' it. Eventually a lack of data on you will be suspicious in and of itself.

There's an easy way around that, though: speak, act, live and think in a manner that's patently inoffensive to anybody.

* I guess I'm being too subtle with my sarcasm, huh. Well, I'll be Larry Literal from now on.

Re: FBI: Carrier IQ files used for "law enforcement purposes"

#32

Post by redrobot5050 »

soundslikeneon wrote: post #26
smokeyj wrote: post #9

A profile is being generated about you, slowly but surely. It starts out as a vague picture, but the more you communicate, the the more clearly you define yourself. It includes your political affiliations, interests you display online, who your friends are, your every movement, your sexual preferences, close secrets, and anything else that can be gathered about you. These profiles are stored in a government database…

The most troubling part of this whole story is that Carrier IQ itself may be breaking Federal laws by logging keystrokes without getting consent from the user...and then the FBI uses that data in investigations. Wonderful.

It acts as a keylogger on some android phones, when Carrier IQ is put into a "debug state". The researcher apparently triggered that by accident without knowing. It's not the default log level. Carrier IQ is likely benign and this whole issue seems to be bad tech journalism and sensationalism.

Re: FBI: Carrier IQ files used for "law enforcement purposes"

#33

Post by redrobot5050 »

soundslikeneon wrote: post #25
kstenerud wrote: post #13

Which is why it's nice to be in full control of the software/hardware stack you use. Walled gardens may look nice and be convenient in the present, and may even give the illusion of security, but in the end they're inevitably abused.

I'm not sure if you meant for this particular interpretation or not, but the way you invoke "walled garden" makes it sound a lot like you are targeting iOS specifically. This couldn't be further from the truth. Based on my own reading. Carrier IQ is installed on many Android-based phones, including those from AT&T, Sprint and T-Mobile networks. Apple, HTC and Samsung have all confirmed that Carrier IQ is on their pho…

Carrier IQ is in iOS 5. It is, however, disabled by default. It is also buried in the second or third level down in Preferences, so its very unlikely a user will enable it by accident -- and will probably only do so upon the instruction of an Apple Store Support Rep.

Re: FBI: Carrier IQ files used for "law enforcement purposes"

#34

Post by JanezStupar »

sounds wrote: post #30
JanezStupar wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And all I can think of is. Holy Shit. Stallman was right. Prescience is a dangerous gift for ones mental health. I like to think of RMS as driven mad by his vision not seeing vision because of being mad.

While I do appreciate your statement in the larger literary context (great artists and prophets deemed insane), and I don't think RMS is justified in everything he does... I reject your allusion to his insanity. Neurotic behavior is not the same as out-of-control psychotic.

But do you know what the worst part is?

He is right and he was right on basically every count of batshit crazy IP/privacy "conspiracy" he ever conceived. And as crazy and repugnant as we find him. He probably is right about what is coming but we don't see it yet.

Re: FBI: Carrier IQ files used for "law enforcement purposes"

#35

Post by rscale »

biff wrote: post #31
pyre wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

... And you can't 'escape' it. Eventually a lack of data on you will be suspicious in and of itself.

There's an easy way around that, though: speak, act, live and think in a manner that's patently inoffensive to anybody. * I guess I'm being too subtle with my sarcasm, huh. Well, I'll be Larry Literal from now on.

It wouldn't surprise me if that, in and of itself, was an identifier.

I find myself thinking of coin-flip experiments, where it's trivial to discern who ran some sort of legitimately random test, and who just made up Heads and Tails, because humans are terrible at approximating randomness.

Re: FBI: Carrier IQ files used for "law enforcement purposes"

#36

Post by fluidcruft »

drunkenmasta wrote: post #12

Not only law enforcement, but general intelligence and especially marketers and advertisers. They will soon know you better than you know yourself http://danielmillsap.com/blog/technology-news/carrier-iq-the...

It's a shame really that we don't have access to the same data for self-discovery. Imagine if everyone had their own data and people could communicate with algorithms. Greenpeace could have a little thing that you run on your data to get tips for improving your shopping habits, etc. Unions could have a way to help you avoid bad products. Or your phone could learn when you need a nudge one way or the other to improve your health.

Re: FBI: Carrier IQ files used for "law enforcement purposes"

#37

Post by JanezStupar »

biff wrote: post #31
pyre wrote: post #21

Earlier quoted context omitted.

... And you can't 'escape' it. Eventually a lack of data on you will be suspicious in and of itself.

There's an easy way around that, though: speak, act, live and think in a manner that's patently inoffensive to anybody. * I guess I'm being too subtle with my sarcasm, huh. Well, I'll be Larry Literal from now on.

Yes, exactly what every corrupt regime likes, people who don't need to be pushed around, but instead get out of the way of their own accord.

People like that invite tyranny upon themselves.

Re: FBI: Carrier IQ files used for "law enforcement purposes"

#38

Post by NinetyNine »

JanezStupar wrote: post #34
sounds wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

While I do appreciate your statement in the larger literary context (great artists and prophets deemed insane), and I don't think RMS is justified in everything he does... I reject your allusion to his insanity. Neurotic behavior is not the same as out-of-control psychotic.

But do you know what the worst part is? He is right and he was right on basically every count of batshit crazy IP/privacy "conspiracy" he ever conceived. And as crazy and repugnant as we find him. He probably is right about what is coming but we don't see it yet.

I think the actual "worst part" is that the guy who was right is a guy which most people find repulsive.

Re: FBI: Carrier IQ files used for "law enforcement purposes"

#39

Post by ChuckMcM »

smokeyj wrote: post #9

A profile is being generated about you, slowly but surely. It starts out as a vague picture, but the more you communicate, the the more clearly you define yourself. It includes your political affiliations, interests you display online, who your friends are, your every movement, your sexual preferences, close secrets, and anything else that can be gathered about you. These profiles are stored in a government database…

It is entirely possible that the FBI is investigating Carrier IQ at the request of the Senate and has documents about what they have found regarding how Carrier IQ uses its data. Those documents would be part of an 'ongoing investigation.'

Still I appreciate the attempt at a FOIA dump.

Re: FBI: Carrier IQ files used for "law enforcement purposes"

#40

Post by toyg »

waitwhat wrote: post #10
ck2 wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's far more likely it was for the CIA since phones are exported with that code in place. The warrantless domestic spying is just a bonus for them.

phones are exported with that code in place They are? (I hadn't been following this that closely but...) My understanding was that the issue was American carriers customising the OEM software and selling that kit to their own users. See, for example, "So far, all of the major British providers have denied using the tool on their handsets" -- http://www.engadget.com/2011/12/05/european-regulators-set-s...

denied using, not denied shipping. Most likely the software is there, but non-US vendors (and law enforcement agencies -- not everyone is as clued up and as resourceful as the FBI) simply don't exploit it.
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