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Sile: A Modern Rewrite of TeX

sile-typesetter.org

21–30 of 181 posts

Re: Sile: A Modern Rewrite of TeX

#21

Something I've wondered, and the Tex users here can probably answer - why not just use Acrobat or Word for math? Does it not support something?

> why not just use Acrobat Does Acrobat have any typesetting capabilities? I thought another app did that and just finalised through Acrobat.

There's acrobat editor, though its more limited than I assumed it seems.

Re: Sile: A Modern Rewrite of TeX

#22

Something I've wondered, and the Tex users here can probably answer - why not just use Acrobat or Word for math? Does it not support something?

LaTeX is an art form. The output is perfect, based only on the code used to make it. Typesetting mathematical expressions or even creating complex diagrams using a library such as `tkz-euclide` is just code. There is no WYSIWYG. No invisible bold spaces[1]. No forgetting which changes you made to try to get it to look right. Everything is right there in the code.

(I am aware of the difference between LaTeX and TeX; I likely haven't used TeX directly but the comparisons here should still work fine.)

There is a huge difference in workflow between generating a document from a complete code file and iterating on a final result with incremental tweaks. That is why I cannot use Acrobat, Word, Google Docs, etc. for creating papers that I would use LaTeX for. It is just not the same, and it is not the workflow I desire.

[1]: https://xkcd.com/2109/

Re: Sile: A Modern Rewrite of TeX

#24

Something I've wondered, and the Tex users here can probably answer - why not just use Acrobat or Word for math? Does it not support something?

Not even close, these are not plaintext based so you can't track changes with git, let alone automatic generation of formulas.

Word has track changes, though not the math support it seems.

Re: Sile: A Modern Rewrite of TeX

#26

TeX is one of those bits of software that's so complex to replace, it'll take another few decades (and likely a few false starts) before we can get there. The fundamentals of TeX's typesetting are amazing, but everything else is just bolted on. You'd probably want to rebuild it with its own, custom language, perhaps inspired more by modern XML/markdown rather than the old TeX language. The biggest problem that we're…

MathML is not really for human to type, just as you rarely type long XML by hand. I don’t see the point of MathML at all.

Re: Sile: A Modern Rewrite of TeX

#28
post #3

Does it come with a context-free syntax? If not, that would be a grave mistake. Being unparseable is one of the biggest problems of TeX, IMO. Not the least because you cannot automatically work with TeX "documents".

I work with TeX quite a lot and I can't even really understand intuitively the principles of the language design let alone the grammar. Like 15 years later and I'm still copy and pasting spells. I'd love to see an CST of my document and figure out why I'm writing the characters I'm writing!

My experience with TeX is a complete opposite. I feel like I can do pretty much anything in plain TeX, with a very good feel of what it is doing in its 'guts'. I wrote parsers in compilers in pure TeX (the latter was admittedly a silly academic exercise). It took a very thorough reading of 'The TeXbook' but after that I am constantly amazed at how deliberate and tasteful Knuth's choices were. TeX is simply ... elegant. I am not sure what 'modern' bells and whistles TeX lacks that everyone is so eager to see. CSS is a nightmare, even with recent additions, it seems clunky, most of its choices look like an afterthought.

It is also somewhat puzzling that same people who advocate for a better grammar would also push the idea of a better markup. So which is it: a better programming experience or a pure markup language that one wants? I feel TeX strikes a near perfect balance here. Most importantly, TeX has stayed nearly unchanged at its core for almost forty years! It is its greatest strength, not weakness. I cannot see what latest fads can improve in TeX

Re: Sile: A Modern Rewrite of TeX

#30
post #17

Am I having a stroke or are the examples not looking good? Subtle kerning issues and the page layout reminds me of a Word letter page. Maybe I'm not understanding its potential.

Maybe try opening the PDF instead of the PNG, the PNG images of text look off to me as well but the font rendering in the PDF looks fine.
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