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The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

productivityreport.org

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Re: The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

#91

Post by paulryanrogers »

foogazi wrote: post #88

There is no conspiracy or rigging- it’s because of sunlight > Additionally for working parents, the hours one can work largely must coincide with school hours as well as times of day when the more affordable option of group childcare, as opposed to private childcare, is available. Dual working parents, like compulsory schooling, are a recent invention The morning work/school schedule is because of sunlight Who would…

Humanity has spent more time in small nomadic tribes, often needing to maintain fire constantly lit and keep watch. There is some evidence that a random spread of rhythms is the norm.

Re: The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

#92

Post by deepburner »

I'm so tired of these "jobs are rigged for social people!!!" or morning people or organized people kinds of posts. There's no rigging, if you want to work alone from 10 PM to 6 AM that's in your prerogative but just because most jobs require collaboration or most people prefer to sleep at night (gasp!) and work while the sun is out does not mean it's "unfair" to you; it just means that you're an outlier. Also the tone of this write-up is unnecessarily patronizing by accusing "morning people" of foregoing their health by sleeping less; hasn't it occured to the author that they might be sleeping early?

I'm writing this as a person who regularly sleeps at 3 AM and works alone in a very disorganized manner, but I have no illusions about the healthiness or ubiquity of my lifestyle.

Re: The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

#93

Post by CipherThrowaway »

collegeburner wrote: post #87
CipherThrowaway wrote: post #84

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Assuming your username means you're in college: I would wait for a few more years before appointing yourself the expert on other peoples sleep physiology. It's easy to think this way in college because people around you will be sleeping poorly or erratically, won't respect sleep or bother with sleep hygiene. Once everyone is out of college the biological differences become a bit more noticeable. Most people will "fix…

i think that's the key point - i don't disagree that there are "the few" where genuinely nothing works. but then there are always the few with some special case where the standard solution doesn't work, but that doesn't mean anyone can say "the workplace is rigged" against them. i think you're right that there's obv a range of how easy it is, but most people can get into something workable with good hygiene.

Yes, most people can get into something workable and most people do. 9-5 probably wouldn't be the norm if this weren't the case. But if someone is years out of college and still can't sleep or function on the 9-5 schedule then chances are they are one of the few rather than the many.

>but that doesn't mean anyone can say "the workplace is rigged" against them.

You absolutely can. "X is rigged against them" is the social model of disability in a nutshell. Workplaces with rigid early schedules are rigged against people with sleep disorders and late chronotypes the same way buildings with no ramps or elevators are rigged against people in wheelchairs and on crutches.

Re: The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

#94

Post by tluyben2 »

frankus wrote: post #76

I have the opposite problem. My energy peaks in the mid-morning, which my workplace has set aside for meetings (partly because we have team members in an earlier time zone, and partly because the manager who set it up that way had a late evening energy peak). So by the time I have an uninterrupted stretch of time, I’m often too drained to really get much done.

I wake up 5 am, work until 11 am and that was the day besides maybe some meetings. It works well; 4 hours of quiet coding, 2 hours working together on code and then maybe 30-60 minutes in management meetings. I have tried different setups but my peak is 7-10; it doesn’t really matter when I slept or how etc. I used to be a night owl and I tried normal hours (9-5); nothing is as productive as what I currently do.

Re: The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

#95

Post by yunwal »

foogazi wrote: post #89

> It’s not that they couldn’t get into bed earlier. It’s that doing so wouldn’t make them sleepy. Do late night people need less sleep than morning people ? Wake up early and you’ll be sleepy at the same time as the morning types

Tried it, doesn’t work, I don’t fall asleep any earlier. Same reason if you slept in an extra 5 hours that wouldn’t make it any easier to stay up until 3.

Re: The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

#96

Post by tluyben2 »

collegeburner wrote: post #4

i think this is a good thing and not "rigged". here's why: 1. you can train yourself to be a morning person. this is coming from someone who is not at all a morning person by nature. so it's not unfair, what it does do is weed out people who don't bother to do so. it selects for disciplined people with a strong work ethic. 2. it is easier to be a night person than a morning person. inertia says it is easier to stay u…

You can fake to be a morning person by setting your alarm early and go to bed 8 hours before that; maybe you are doing a good enough job and have a productive life. However, maybe you would’ve been far more productive if you would’ve just slept when tired and worked when you naturally wake up. In my experience, that works a lot better than wringing yourself in some kind of schedule.

I don’t know very many (any, come to think of it) people who would naturally choose 9-5 and indeed, less and less do adhere to them. I prefer 5 am to 11 am for office hours and others prefer 11 am to 3 pm and then 5 pm to 9 pm etc.

People who prefer actual office hours I don’t know personally, but I guess they exist.

Re: The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

#98

Post by quantified »

culopatin wrote: post #80
semireg wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Define: kid. Parent wrote “having kids” and take this from a father of a 5 and 2 year old it’s: “daddy cheezy eggz!!!” at 530am no matter what.

I read this three times and I still don’t know what your comment was supposed to say or mean.

Children wake up early and you need to wake up with them, feed them nurture them. They'll take you out of your sleep. Actually waking up is on you.

Re: The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

#99

Post by quantified »

deepburner wrote: post #92

I'm so tired of these "jobs are rigged for social people!!!" or morning people or organized people kinds of posts. There's no rigging, if you want to work alone from 10 PM to 6 AM that's in your prerogative but just because most jobs require collaboration or most people prefer to sleep at night (gasp!) and work while the sun is out does not mean it's "unfair" to you; it just means that you're an outlier. Also the ton…

Construction work is rigged for morning people. Not every job is at a desk.

Re: The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

#100

Post by quantified »

wnevets wrote: post #36
lr4444lr wrote: post #14

Yeah, because more senior workers eventually have kids, and kids need a proper morning wake up, and child care doesn't run until 10 PM. Don't like it? There are lots of industries with nighttime work or extensive travel obligations.

> Yeah, because more senior workers eventually have kids, and kids need a proper morning wake up, and child care doesn't run until 10 PM. Which do you think came first, jobs that start in the morning or child care that start in the morning?

Jobs that start in the morning. Farm work for example, those jobs have been around a very long time. Nice to have someone watch the kids, but they came with you to work if necessary. Modern factory and desk jobs are fairly recent inventions.
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