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The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

productivityreport.org

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Re: The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

#81

Post by culopatin »

brendoelfrendo wrote: post #28
lr4444lr wrote: post #14

Yeah, because more senior workers eventually have kids, and kids need a proper morning wake up, and child care doesn't run until 10 PM. Don't like it? There are lots of industries with nighttime work or extensive travel obligations.

Hm, I think this is backwards; there's plenty of evidence that we wake up kids way too early. Really, school schedules are as they are to fit around work schedules, not the other way around. https://www.cdc.gov/sleep/features/schools-start-too-early.h...

Except that school hours end at 3:30 around me and I don’t understand what I would be supposed to do if I continued having my current schedule

Re: The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

#82

Post by arrow7000 »

trillic wrote: post #13

Early to sleep, early to rise, makes a man healthy, wealthy, and wise. In my case I have no choice, my SO works in medicine so I’m up when she’s up at 5 whether I like it or not. I’ve gotten a lot more productive since we started sharing a space. Is it the early rise, or the constant presence of the opposite sex?

Ah yes that reliable way of proving a claim: quoting a rhyme

Re: The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

#83

Post by karmakaze »

SketchySeaBeast wrote: post #32
version_five wrote: post #12

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As a counterpoint, I have worked with many "night people" who will work very late into the night on problems, sticking with them until they are solved. I'm a morning person, more by necessity of having other stuff to do in the evening, and I find I end up being more likely to drop a problem without finishing it because I have to leave work. It's all anecdotal, but especially in software, I see how people who have arr…

That seems to run counter to the idea that stopping and walking away rather than just grinding until it's solved is beneficial to problem solving.

There's a difference between grinding and being in a flow state at 'quitting time'.

Re: The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

#84

Post by CipherThrowaway »

collegeburner wrote: post #22
YokoZar wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, you can't. Well, maybe you personally can. But all the actual science says that willpower, sleep hygiene, and sunlight exposure only move the margins a bit for those with inflexible night-time chronotypes. Doing everything "right" is not going to make a 5am natural sleeper into a morning person, it's going to make them into a 3am natural sleeper.

sorry, nothing about our bodies tells me they're this inflexible. i wonder if the "nighttime chronotypes" controlled for things that actually would influence it, like light exposure. regardless, one of the things that worked best for me was rigging a bright light to dawn gradually at a early hour, and cutting off my bright light exposure at a early hour. even if i have a "night chronotype" it's still possible to "tri…

Assuming your username means you're in college: I would wait for a few more years before appointing yourself the expert on other peoples sleep physiology. It's easy to think this way in college because people around you will be sleeping poorly or erratically, won't respect sleep or bother with sleep hygiene.

Once everyone is out of college the biological differences become a bit more noticeable. Most people will "fix" their sleeping relatively easily. Others will struggle at first but eventually make it work by adopting strict sleep hygiene and routine. Then a few will find that no amount of sleep hygiene gets them into a good cycle for the standard working day. For some of them the issue will be severe enough to qualify as a clinical disorder like DSPD. DSPD is known to be extremely difficult to treat.

Re: The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

#85

Post by dabbledash »

culopatin wrote: post #80
semireg wrote: post #46

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Define: kid. Parent wrote “having kids” and take this from a father of a 5 and 2 year old it’s: “daddy cheezy eggz!!!” at 530am no matter what.

I read this three times and I still don’t know what your comment was supposed to say or mean.

I think they mean: the studies showing bad outcomes from waking up 'kids' early are specifically about teenagers. Little kids get up very early, and the schedules of parents have to account for this.

Re: The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

#86

Post by Gigachad »

pc86 wrote: post #57
pleb_nz wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think it's ok for kids to be in child care until 10pm?

Depends when they start. Depends why they're there. Depends on the child care. Being in child care at 10pm isn't inherently any better or worse than being in child care at 10am. It's all relative.

No it isn’t. The sun isn’t a social construct. As much as people here want to disconnect from nature and reality. Some things are still rooted in real world unchangeable nature.

Re: The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

#87

Post by collegeburner »

CipherThrowaway wrote: post #84
collegeburner wrote: post #22

Earlier quoted context omitted.

sorry, nothing about our bodies tells me they're this inflexible. i wonder if the "nighttime chronotypes" controlled for things that actually would influence it, like light exposure. regardless, one of the things that worked best for me was rigging a bright light to dawn gradually at a early hour, and cutting off my bright light exposure at a early hour. even if i have a "night chronotype" it's still possible to "tri…

Assuming your username means you're in college: I would wait for a few more years before appointing yourself the expert on other peoples sleep physiology. It's easy to think this way in college because people around you will be sleeping poorly or erratically, won't respect sleep or bother with sleep hygiene. Once everyone is out of college the biological differences become a bit more noticeable. Most people will "fix…

i think that's the key point - i don't disagree that there are "the few" where genuinely nothing works. but then there are always the few with some special case where the standard solution doesn't work, but that doesn't mean anyone can say "the workplace is rigged" against them. i think you're right that there's obv a range of how easy it is, but most people can get into something workable with good hygiene.

Re: The Workplace Is Rigged to Favor Morning People

#88

Post by foogazi »

There is no conspiracy or rigging- it’s because of sunlight

> Additionally for working parents, the hours one can work largely must coincide with school hours as well as times of day when the more affordable option of group childcare, as opposed to private childcare, is available.

Dual working parents, like compulsory schooling, are a recent invention

The morning work/school schedule is because of sunlight

Who would send their kids to school at night or in the dark

Think of the history of humanity and thinking of working the fields or construction at night because you are a “night person”

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