Lula defeats Bolsonaro to again become Brazil’s president • Hacker News Board

Re: Lula defeats Bolsonaro to again become Brazil’s president

#31

Post by gtirloni » Mon, Oct 31, 2022, 12:30 AM UTC

Dma54rhs wrote: post #30

gtirloni wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you have any evidence of fraud?

The problem with electronic voting is that it's either impossible or extremely unlikely to prove either way. Germans and many others have banned them for that reason.

Usually unprovable hypothesis are discarded.

Re: Lula defeats Bolsonaro to again become Brazil’s president

#32

Post by Dma54rhs » Mon, Oct 31, 2022, 12:34 AM UTC

gtirloni wrote: post #31

Dma54rhs wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with electronic voting is that it's either impossible or extremely unlikely to prove either way. Germans and many others have banned them for that reason.

Usually unprovable hypothesis are discarded.

Not really. Definitely not when it comes to voting. Before Trump the idea of voting machine fraud and the impossible task to be certain of integrity of the elections was fairly non conspiratorial idea.

I've never seen voting machines but I remember reading constantly about US southern states using them and the suspicions. As I said many democratic nations have banned them.

Re: Lula defeats Bolsonaro to again become Brazil’s president

#33

Post by suggestion » Mon, Oct 31, 2022, 12:36 AM UTC

gtirloni wrote: post #31

Dma54rhs wrote: post #30

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The problem with electronic voting is that it's either impossible or extremely unlikely to prove either way. Germans and many others have banned them for that reason.

Usually unprovable hypothesis are discarded.

So the unprovable hypothesis that the election was legitimate and all votes were cast legitimately and accurately should be discarded

Re: Lula defeats Bolsonaro to again become Brazil’s president

#34

Post by gtirloni » Mon, Oct 31, 2022, 12:45 AM UTC

Dma54rhs wrote: post #32

gtirloni wrote: post #31

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Usually unprovable hypothesis are discarded.

Not really. Definitely not when it comes to voting. Before Trump the idea of voting machine fraud and the impossible task to be certain of integrity of the elections was fairly non conspiratorial idea. I've never seen voting machines but I remember reading constantly about US southern states using them and the suspicions. As I said many democratic nations have banned them.

Just show evidence the electronic voting was rigged in Brazil and we can all move on.

Re: Lula defeats Bolsonaro to again become Brazil’s president

#35

Post by guilherme-puida » Mon, Oct 31, 2022, 12:45 AM UTC

it_citizen wrote: post #25

The fact that the result was so close is chilling. How bad do populists have to be to not be re-elected?

If Bolsonaro had managed the pandemic just a little bit better we would have won, I think.

Re: Lula defeats Bolsonaro to again become Brazil’s president

#36

Post by anderber » Mon, Oct 31, 2022, 12:46 AM UTC

shimonabi wrote: post #20

If I was Brazilian I would never support Bolsanaro, but he was right about the electronic voting machines. It is shocking to me that there is not a paper record for each cast vote in Brazil.

I find that silly, what do you mean there's no paper record? Each machine has a print out of the total votes it has in it. These machines are also not connected to the internet. And lastly, he sure didn't have a problem with the machines for the several years he was in office, right? Only now that someone was polling better than him. I find the Brazilian electronic voting machines to be better than how we do it in the US.

Re: Lula defeats Bolsonaro to again become Brazil’s president

#37

Post by Dma54rhs » Mon, Oct 31, 2022, 1:01 AM UTC

gtirloni wrote: post #34

Dma54rhs wrote: post #32

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not really. Definitely not when it comes to voting. Before Trump the idea of voting machine fraud and the impossible task to be certain of integrity of the elections was fairly non conspiratorial idea. I've never seen voting machines but I remember reading constantly about US southern states using them and the suspicions. As I said many democratic nations have banned them.

Just show evidence the electronic voting was rigged in Brazil and we can all move on.

I don't have such evidence and I don't claim it, but I do claim using machines it's impossible to prove otherwise which is a problem in democracy.

Re: Lula defeats Bolsonaro to again become Brazil’s president

#38

Post by nullish_signal » Mon, Oct 31, 2022, 1:19 AM UTC

ifdefdebug wrote: post #4

Curious if he's gonna pull a Trump.

By having his Vice President's count of State Electoral Votes get interrupted by a Pedestrian Tour, right as he gets to the first state with Dueling Electors? And then ignore all Dueling Elector votes after resuming the count?

Would be real weird to see that happen in Brazil too

Re: Lula defeats Bolsonaro to again become Brazil’s president

#39

Post by superchroma » Mon, Oct 31, 2022, 1:24 AM UTC

ShivShankaran wrote: post #3

Worth noting that Lula is more pro-russian than bolsonoro and blames zelensky for the war equally. The coming decade is going to be as profound as end of world war

Well BRICS is a thing, I wouldn't expect Brazil to break in solidarity.

Re: Lula defeats Bolsonaro to again become Brazil’s president

#40

Post by dragonwriter » Mon, Oct 31, 2022, 1:28 AM UTC

superchroma wrote: post #39

ShivShankaran wrote: post #3

Worth noting that Lula is more pro-russian than bolsonoro and blames zelensky for the war equally. The coming decade is going to be as profound as end of world war

Well BRICS is a thing, I wouldn't expect Brazil to break in solidarity.

> Well BRICS is a thing, I wouldn't expect Brazil to break in solidarity.

BRICS is a thing the way FAANG is a thing, not the way NATO is a thing. Solidarity is not one of its features.