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Why does the US allow a controversial weedkiller banned across the world?

theguardian.com

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Re: Why does the US allow a controversial weedkiller banned across the world?

#51

Post by hunter-gatherer »

bastawhiz wrote: post #27

Herbicides aside, I worry a lot about the chemicals that we consider "normal". I signed up for a pest service after purchasing my home because we were getting ants and water bugs in the house. They have a package they they sell that includes a "full property" treatment, which I don't think I need. They list off a couple down "pests" that they kill, and go through a long script about how safe the chemicals are. But li…

Yeah, we have ants in our house in the summer. I have found that as long as everything is clean, I hardly do see them. Usually if we spill something and miss a spot and tbey show up then they generally have it all cleaned up and are out of my way by the time I get back from work.

I've sworn off pesticides and herbicides and the effect on my property has been amamzing. It's like a little nature hub. Lots of insects outside, but it hasn't been an issue. We started to have lots of birds show up every day to feast, and there is a noticeable difference in the amoujt of birds that show up compared to all the homes around me.

At first all the pesky weird insects show up, but eventually the birds and bats and other predatory insects balance things out. One group I wasn't to keen on was a wasp nest. I got rid of that one but they moved to the other end of the property and aren't an issue. I don't know... I feel like we humans are too afraid of nature these days. I mean, everyone likes hiking in the national parks and tells themselves they want to preserve nature but don't really seem to interested on the day to day things that can help preserve other species' habitats.

I'm not perfect either. It takes some effort to question norms and behaviour you were taught, so I'm just as guilty as everyone else.

Edit: On mobile. Forgive the typos.

Re: Why does the US allow a controversial weedkiller banned across the world?

#52

Post by gruez »

jmclnx wrote: post #43
Scarblac wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

And they're allowed because contributing to a campaign is considered speech, I think? The US has the right to free bribing.

Correct, and any Companies, including Large Companies can "contribute" any amount they want because they are considered "people".

>including Large Companies can "contribute" any amount they want because they are considered "people".

That's not an accurate representation of the court's opinion. Here's the summary given on wikipedia

>The majority ruled that the Freedom of the Press clause of the First Amendment protects associations of individuals in addition to individual speakers, and further that the First Amendment does not allow prohibitions of speech based on the identity of the speaker. Corporations, as associations of individuals, therefore have free speech rights under the First Amendment. Because spending money is essential to disseminating speech, as established in Buckley v. Valeo, limiting a corporation's ability to spend money is unconstitutional, because it limits the ability of its members to associate effectively and to speak on political issues.

Corporations being considered "people" (aka. corporate personhood) has nothing to do with it.

Re: Why does the US allow a controversial weedkiller banned across the world?

#53

Post by rgrieselhuber »

Nanana909 wrote: post #7
boomskats wrote: post #3

SPOILER ALERT: the answer is 'lobbying'. That is, the free, democratic, and fully legal, bribery of government legislators and elected officials by profit-driven corporate bodies. I, for one, was not surprised.

> lobbying'. That is, the free, democratic, and fully legal, bribery of government legislators and elected officials by profit-driven corporate bodies. That’s not really the definition of lobbying though. We should try to avoid hyperboles. Additionally, bribery is not legal and that’s not even remotely the form that the vast majority of lobbying takes today.

This is gaslighting at its finest.

Re: Why does the US allow a controversial weedkiller banned across the world?

#54

Post by zdragnar »

collegeburner wrote: post #29
orwin wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Exposure to leaded gasoline and diesel is way more likely to have caused this increase tbh. In France, the increased allergies isn't as noticeable in rural area as in cities. If it was caused by chemical we use on plant, the reverse would be true.

another hypothesis i heard was rural kids grew up with their immune systems exposed to more stuff and so better trained/less likely to overreact. personally, i always noticed kids with allergies tended to be weak and sickly much more often, so maybe that's related.

Allergies are a form of immune response to normally innocuous things.

It makes sense that there is general coincidence between severe allergies and other immune disorders.

Re: Why does the US allow a controversial weedkiller banned across the world?

#55

Post by guelo »

ErikCorry wrote: post #36
epgui wrote: post #5

I’m a biochemist, and it drives me nuts how much the public worries about glyphosate but not really any other herbicides. Glyphosate may not be perfect but I’d worry more about almost any other type of herbicide, most of which are absolutely nasty.

For those of us who are not biochemists, he's talking about Roundup (glyphosate).

Which is not what the article is about

Re: Why does the US allow a controversial weedkiller banned across the world?

#56

Post by nemo44x »

kornhole wrote: post #39
bastawhiz wrote: post #27

Herbicides aside, I worry a lot about the chemicals that we consider "normal". I signed up for a pest service after purchasing my home because we were getting ants and water bugs in the house. They have a package they they sell that includes a "full property" treatment, which I don't think I need. They list off a couple down "pests" that they kill, and go through a long script about how safe the chemicals are. But li…

Your skepticism is warranted. Of course the negative affects of these chemicals is down played by those who sell them. Many leech into ecosystems, our homes, and our bodies causing obvious and latent issues. I personally love insects and plants considered weeds as they are critical to our biosphere. I have learned to live with and around them managing a balance both in my house and in my garden. Chemical warfare shou…

Termites ruin a home. Ticks are more dangerous than the pesticides we spray on foliage. Mosquitos are just plain annoying. There’s also sone invasive species that bring down certain trees, such as Lantern Flys.

Re: Why does the US allow a controversial weedkiller banned across the world?

#57

Post by deepsquirrelnet »

rascul wrote: post #20
sonofhans wrote: post #10

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course it’s bribery. Everyone involved knows it’s bribery. The money is given with expectation of reward. If the bribing entity didn’t expect a direct reward, they wouldn’t give the money. Now, everyone tries to hide behind levels of abstraction — “It’s just lobbying!” — but those are just fig leaves and reasonable people should see through them. E.g., “Exxon gave the money to my campaign committee, and I’m not in…

I don't think lobbying implies bribery. If you go and speak to your representative for a few minutes to try and convince them to support your position, isn't that lobbying? Even if no money changed hands, just words?

> If you go and speak to your representative for a few minutes to try and convince them to support your position

Give it a try. Let me know how it goes.

If you don’t have a campaign donation lined up, you’re not getting in the door.

Re: Why does the US allow a controversial weedkiller banned across the world?

#58

Post by ErikCorry »

guelo wrote: post #55
ErikCorry wrote: post #36

Earlier quoted context omitted.

For those of us who are not biochemists, he's talking about Roundup (glyphosate).

Which is not what the article is about

True, but there are probably many situations where Roundup is an alternative to Paraquat, and if one of them is much less dangerous than the other, then that's relevant information, (that could have been presented in a less confusing way).

Re: Why does the US allow a controversial weedkiller banned across the world?

#59

Post by TimTheTinker »

HPsquared wrote: post #44
TimTheTinker wrote: post #9

I'm more worried about the GMO "roundup ready" seeds they sell, and the crops that result. Those contain alterations that (I hypothesize) are partially responsible for increased allergies in the US population.

I can't think of a mechanism for GM crops causing allergies. How would this work?

Genetic modification often produces altered proteins. These protein signatures do not match human T-cell allowlists, causing immune response.

Even if the modification is a simple addition between adjacent start and stop codons, that kind of modification could alter meta encodings that control other aspects of cell regulation, including (potentially) gene expression -- which would cause proteins that are coded for but that normally aren't present to become present in crops. Even one newly expressed protein (that is normally not ever expressed) could trigger immune response.

Re: Why does the US allow a controversial weedkiller banned across the world?

#60

Post by rb229 »

epgui wrote: post #5

I’m a biochemist, and it drives me nuts how much the public worries about glyphosate but not really any other herbicides. Glyphosate may not be perfect but I’d worry more about almost any other type of herbicide, most of which are absolutely nasty.

I do not really buy this reasoning. Glyphosate has been proven to be harmful [ source: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Glyphosate ]. Other things might be worse, sure, but that does not mean we can allow Glyohosate to be used without thinking about the risks.
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