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I tried starting a manufacturing unit in India (2020)

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Re: I tried starting a manufacturing unit in India (2020)

#21

Post by rqtwteye »

etaioinshrdlu wrote: post #10
spaceman_2020 wrote: post #8

India's obsession with paperwork is unceasing and baffling. Everything requires an application, even when everything can be done digitally. You need letters and stamps to get anything done. Case in point: the "company stamps" that are required for everything you do with your business. From getting a debit card to changing the maturity instructions for a corporate deposit, you need to sign your name AND stamp it with…

Countries with high paperwork and bureaucratic burden are famous for also being highly corrupt. This is probably not a coincidence. Likely all the excess paperwork makes it easier to hide what's really going on, easy to provide roadblocks for those who don't pay, and easier to generally hide bad activity in a sea of noise.

I would replace “countries” with “systems”. You can see this in the US with government contracting or health billing. Tons of paperwork but totally opaque and prone to corruption.

Re: I tried starting a manufacturing unit in India (2020)

#22

Post by newyankee »

rohan_shah wrote: post #15
anovikov wrote: post #4

If building something on agricultural land is hard, it is good: it is called agricultural for a reason. Maybe buying a parcel of industrial or commercial land would have ended up cheaper?

Author of the article here: All the land in India is agricultural by default. Except in some desert states.

Fellow Pune resident here. I think there is a potential for a transparency startup here. Parts of stuff like these exist. I would buy you lunch/ beer/ whatever to learn from some of your experiences.

Re: I tried starting a manufacturing unit in India (2020)

#23

Post by rohan_shah »

newyankee wrote: post #22
rohan_shah wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Author of the article here: All the land in India is agricultural by default. Except in some desert states.

Fellow Pune resident here. I think there is a potential for a transparency startup here. Parts of stuff like these exist. I would buy you lunch/ beer/ whatever to learn from some of your experiences.

I'm building a startup for solving this. Let's meet. Twitter DM @ mrohanshah

Re: I tried starting a manufacturing unit in India (2020)

#25

Post by giva »

newyankee wrote: post #9
giva wrote: post #6

> Yes, you need to obtain “permission” before you build any manufacturing structure on your own land with your own money. This permission is called the NA or Non-Agricultural Certificate. Well, I though it was this way everywhere in the world. In Europe, at least, you cannot build anything on agricultural land unless it is a n agricultural structure or you get the classification changed, which is not easy.

Everything is right in theory. This article is about how difficult it is for a small entrepreneur, you essentially need big pockets and right connections to start something even very small. All this does is creates a set of entrenched local businesses which run hand-in-hand very transparently with local political interests. This is the whole reason Western folks never understand why China succeeded so fast, it is bec…

Had this article been the difficulties to build a manufacturing plan on an area reserved for industrial use, I would agree. But I don't believe that changing the destination of agricultural land has to be a fast and easy process.

Re: I tried starting a manufacturing unit in India (2020)

#26

Post by roguesherlock »

2Gkashmiri wrote: post #14
spaceman_2020 wrote: post #8

India's obsession with paperwork is unceasing and baffling. Everything requires an application, even when everything can be done digitally. You need letters and stamps to get anything done. Case in point: the "company stamps" that are required for everything you do with your business. From getting a debit card to changing the maturity instructions for a corporate deposit, you need to sign your name AND stamp it with…

dude. unless you are doing some space age shit or something, you don't need to set up a company in india to do business. sure the whole "limited liability" and that but in reality that is just a smokescreen. just use your personal pan card to open a bank account, get a GST registration, do income tax audit and you will be done. No compliance, no nothing. i do taxes and books for businesses with 250+ Crore turnover an…

isn't the tax burden for sole proprietorship higher than for say limited company? 30 vs 25 iirc?

Re: I tried starting a manufacturing unit in India (2020)

#27

Post by systemvoltage »

etaioinshrdlu wrote: post #10
spaceman_2020 wrote: post #8

India's obsession with paperwork is unceasing and baffling. Everything requires an application, even when everything can be done digitally. You need letters and stamps to get anything done. Case in point: the "company stamps" that are required for everything you do with your business. From getting a debit card to changing the maturity instructions for a corporate deposit, you need to sign your name AND stamp it with…

Countries with high paperwork and bureaucratic burden are famous for also being highly corrupt. This is probably not a coincidence. Likely all the excess paperwork makes it easier to hide what's really going on, easy to provide roadblocks for those who don't pay, and easier to generally hide bad activity in a sea of noise.

This has nothing to do with physical paperwork (See Japan which runs on paper forms even today; most hospitals in US are paperless but they're far from efficient), but the underlying policies that dictate the requirements and how the approval process must be conducted, number of parties/agencies/teams involved and the incentives put in place to make sure it gets done within a certain timeframe (QA controls). Some governments are better than others.

Paperwork really isn't to blame here because even if everything was digital, the people behind the operation and the policies that govern their behavior is still the same. The problem isn't the interface between citizens and the government, it is the backend source code of the government.

You are all barking at the wrong tree.

Re: I tried starting a manufacturing unit in India (2020)

#28

Post by rob74 »

giva wrote: post #6

> Yes, you need to obtain “permission” before you build any manufacturing structure on your own land with your own money. This permission is called the NA or Non-Agricultural Certificate. Well, I though it was this way everywhere in the world. In Europe, at least, you cannot build anything on agricultural land unless it is a n agricultural structure or you get the classification changed, which is not easy.

This! In Germany it's simply not possible to declare a parcel of your own choosing as "Non-Agricultural". Land is of course taken out of agricultural use and reclassified for industrial or residential use, but only in predefined areas. Of course there's lobbying and speculation involved, because reclassification multiplies the value of the parcels, but it takes much longer than a year from the first proposal until you can actually build something, and certain conditions have to be met, e.g. good accessibility by road, other infrastructure (power supply, sewage etc.)...
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