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Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

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Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#401

Post by hot_gril »

bobbylarrybobby wrote: post #398
scoofy wrote: post #390

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seriously. I will not take anyone seriously about how "Apple just cared about a better standard" when they literally don't allow it to be made a standard . It's just a connector. If you're not letting everyone use it, it's not about it being better... it's about rent-seeking. Which is exactly what the EU legislation seeks to end.

Not to shill for a trillion dollar megacorp, but when you've got lightning and the competition has USB mini, how exactly is that rent seeking? You've developed an objectively better product, don't you deserve something for it?

It was in fact much better for several years, and it probably inspired USB-C. At some point it wasn't, and they kept making excuses to keep it anyway. I don't agree with the EU law btw, just saying Apple wasn't keeping Lightning for actual usability reasons in the end.

Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#402

Post by Dylan16807 »

paulmd wrote: post #92
WaxProlix wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The contrast between "force Apple to stop adhering to legacy standards, USB-C is the future!!!" and "gubmint hands off muh 8-pin aux connectors!!!" is interesting. Both of these are the same stance to me, "existing industry standards appear to suffice, why foist something different on the market?" I don't think governments are behind a lot of these changes so that last bit is probably exaggeration but seems misplac…

> existing industry standards appear to suffice reminder: lightning came first , because the industry couldn't get its shit together and agree on a successor to micro-b, despite acknowledgement of the shortcomings. lightning is the pcie 8-pin in this comparison: you may not like the technical limitations it imposes, but, it works well enough that you can build products around it. So why impose a change to The Current…

> lightning is the pcie 8-pin in this comparison: you may not like the technical limitations it imposes, but, it works well enough that you can build products around it. So why impose a change to The Current Thing and do this whole big changeover if it's already working well enough?

That would be valid if everyone was using it.

If all phones had lightning I would be much less inclined to make them change it.

> But that's the hardware that's in people's hands right now.

The hardware that's in people's hands right now is overwhelmingly USB C. That's why the motivation exists to get Apple to be compatible.

> 48V power delivery - it would all be a lot easier and safer

I don't know, that's getting pretty high. Do you then convert directly from 48v to 1.1v or do you need to add a second conversion stage onto GPUs?

Edit: Though given this post, the new PCIe connector seems like an overall good idea, and it's just some adapters that need to be recalled. https://www.igorslab.de/en/adapter-of-the-gray-analyzed-nvid...

Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#403

Post by GuB-42 »

bobbylarrybobby wrote: post #250
scelerat wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Nothing can fix the stupidity of USB-C cables, though What is the stupidity of USB-C cables? Honestly don't know, simply not up on USB or cable technology

Unlike every other connector, with USB C the male end is in the phone and the cable is female. Since the male end has a thin piece that inserts into the cable, it both invites lint to get stuck the port and makes it somewhat risky to clean out, as snapping that thin piece requires replacing the port (and maybe the whole phone depending on how it's made). Compare to lightning, which AFAIK is indestructible, and lint c…

Did anyone ever snapped that "thin piece"? It is not that thin, and in fact, I never managed to break even the much thinner micro-USB tongue.

I have broken USB sockets, and seen broken sockets, but every time, it was either wear or the connector being torn off a PCB (they are not always mounted properly). The only times I have seen a broken tongue was with USB-A connectors (the big ones), probably from a plug being forcefully inserted the wrong way. Micro-USB doesn't have this problem because of the shape of the connector prevents it and USB-C is reversible.

Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#404

Post by scarface74 »

Ferrotin wrote: post #376
scarface74 wrote: post #108

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I'm sorry, but I don't see how we can lay the blame for corporations cutting corners on completely unrelated legislation. You mean the same legislation that can enforce USB C can’t enforce a minimum standard for USB C: - must support USB 3 speeds - must support video over USB and a certain minimum standard (this is a standard) - etc?

You’re already free to buy a phone with those features, without worrying about extra chargers.

The aim was to “prevent ewaste” by “standardizing cables”. The “standard” that the EU is mandating doesn’t do any of that if an Android user who bought an iPhone can’t use the “standard” cable to its potential.

Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#405

Post by hot_gril »

scarface74 wrote: post #393
hot_gril wrote: post #387

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not free, but it's cheap. A good USB-C cable costs less than $5, not $15. You hardly ever need a good one either, just one for charging. Re ewaste, that's a different topic. I'm just talking about licensing fees.

Can that $5 USB C cable support data transfers at USB3 speeds and video over USB C? USB C also has licensing fees. The stated reason was to prevent “ewaste” and yes you can buy a $5 lightning cable. Here is a 3 pack for $10 https://a.co/d/8FB2naZ

You're actually right about the video -C cables. That feature costs extra, and I didn't notice the first time. But it's rare to need one, and they'll get cheaper over time.

That 3-pack MFi Lightning for $10 is a new phenomenon. It was never like that before. I can believe it's not fake, just cheap cause it's old tech and on its way out.

Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#406

Post by Dylan16807 »

kitsunesoba wrote: post #384
popcalc wrote: post #317

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sunk cost fallacy much?

More like there's no point in throwing out a bunch of perfectly good cables. Would rather they get tossed because they no longer function.

There's also no point in getting a new phone one or two years early.

And this will only extend the life of that Lightning stuff by so much.

So you have to compare both scenarios in their entirety. They both generate waste in different ways.

And some of that Lightning stuff can get adapters, 3 for $7 on amazon.

Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#407

Post by hot_gril »

Dylan16807 wrote: post #389
scarface74 wrote: post #369

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So how well are the USB C cables going to work that follow the minimum “mandate” that doesn’t require cables to support data at all? How well are they going to work when people pick up a “USB C” cable and wonder why they aren’t seeing video when they connect their phone to their TV?

> So how well are the USB C cables going to work that follow the minimum “mandate” that doesn’t require cables to support data at all? Citation needed? I think those are below the minimum. > How well are they going to work when people pick up a “USB C” cable and wonder why they aren’t seeing video when they connect their phone to their TV? They probably feel similar to people with lightning cables.

> They probably feel similar to people with lightning cables.

Lightning supports video. Or were you just making a joke about how unreliable it is? Cause man, I can't even charge my phone sometimes.

Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#408

Post by Dylan16807 »

scarface74 wrote: post #395
Dylan16807 wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So how well are the USB C cables going to work that follow the minimum “mandate” that doesn’t require cables to support data at all? Citation needed? I think those are below the minimum. > How well are they going to work when people pick up a “USB C” cable and wonder why they aren’t seeing video when they connect their phone to their TV? They probably feel similar to people with lightning cables.

> Citation needed? I think those are below the minimum. The law states nothing about data transfers or anything else.

Oh, I thought you meant spec minimum not legal minimum.

Does the law not say the cables have to meet the USB C spec?

Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#409

Post by yreg »

Marsymars wrote: post #223
batuhanicoz wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Not an expert but I would think not putting a board in is way easier than putting in a different one. It's also harder to manage supply for two different boards with different connectors, making different cables, split the accessories ecosystem etc. Apple, esp. under Tim Cook, is super efficient when it comes to this stuff.

They could do the same for EU iPhones; sell them without a physical port and make people charge wirelessly.

True, but that sounds like a PR nightmare. In that case I would expect them to go no-ports worldwide and claim that their amazing MagSafe charging is superior and how bold they are.

Re: Apple says iPhones will switch to USB-C chargers to comply with new EU law

#410

Post by Dylan16807 »

hot_gril wrote: post #407
Dylan16807 wrote: post #389

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> So how well are the USB C cables going to work that follow the minimum “mandate” that doesn’t require cables to support data at all? Citation needed? I think those are below the minimum. > How well are they going to work when people pick up a “USB C” cable and wonder why they aren’t seeing video when they connect their phone to their TV? They probably feel similar to people with lightning cables.

> They probably feel similar to people with lightning cables. Lightning supports video. Or were you just making a joke about how unreliable it is? Cause man, I can't even charge my phone sometimes.

Lightning doesn't support video over mere cables. You need a complicated adapter that decompresses the video sent by the device. It's like a tiny streaming setup.

If you just pick up a generic lightning cable, you're not getting video.

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