Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups • Hacker News Board

Re: Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups

#51

Post by Retric » Sat, Dec 10, 2011, 12:43 AM UTC

anamax wrote: post #43

timjahn wrote: post #18

Throwing $2B at startups isn't going to create a new generation of entrepreneurs. 1. Fix the healthcare system. Right now, you're punished if you don't work for a large company in the sense that you're charged up the wazoo for health insurance. Work for a large company and it's close to free. 2. Fix student loans. One could argue don't go to college but I think we can agree there's some value to good schools. 3. Educ…

> 1. Fix the healthcare system. Right now, you're punished if you don't work for a large company in the sense that you're charged up the wazoo for health insurance. Work for a large company and it's close to free. No, it's not "almost free". It's paid for by the company. And yes, paying yourself is tax-deductible in many circumstances. I've actually paid for health insurance out of pocket as an "older american". Rent…

The US and Canadian government spend the same amount per person on healthcare but Canada has universal health care. On average the US and Canadian healthcare systems provide vary similar outcomes on average.

So, clearly more government involvement is an option. But, so is less the US could save a ridiculous amount of money if we could stop wasting it on end of life care that proves little to no benefit. Healthcare is an endless money sink and because the US government agrees to hand over money with little veto power we have are left with the worst healthcare system money can buy.

Just think about this for a second would you rather have an extra 250,000$ to spend when your young, or have a 50/50% shot of spending an extra 2 months on your death bead in a semi lucid state?

Re: Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups

#52

Post by andrewpi » Sat, Dec 10, 2011, 12:44 AM UTC

ryanackley wrote: post #41

timjahn wrote: post #18

Throwing $2B at startups isn't going to create a new generation of entrepreneurs. 1. Fix the healthcare system. Right now, you're punished if you don't work for a large company in the sense that you're charged up the wazoo for health insurance. Work for a large company and it's close to free. 2. Fix student loans. One could argue don't go to college but I think we can agree there's some value to good schools. 3. Educ…

fix student loans I put myself through school on a student loan. I was very grateful for it. I was charged a reasonable tax deductible interest rate. So I'm curious about what is actually broken?

Massive inflation in tuition in the last 20-30 years.

Re: Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups

#53

Post by rbanffy » Sat, Dec 10, 2011, 12:50 AM UTC

anigbrowl wrote: post #42

paul wrote: post #13

Fixing the immigration and patent systems would be infinitely more helpful (i.e. stop getting in the way).

Congress has to do that, the executive branch can't. To the extent that the executive branch is streamlining the existing immigration system, they're being derided as amnesty-offering traitors by the xenophobic know-nothings that want Berlin Wall 2.0.

Just as a side note, you really don't want an executive branch that can do that (fixing the immigration and patent systems).

edit: sorry if it didn't end up as clear as it should

Re: Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups

#54

Post by mkramlich » Sat, Dec 10, 2011, 12:50 AM UTC

timjahn wrote: post #18

Throwing $2B at startups isn't going to create a new generation of entrepreneurs. 1. Fix the healthcare system. Right now, you're punished if you don't work for a large company in the sense that you're charged up the wazoo for health insurance. Work for a large company and it's close to free. 2. Fix student loans. One could argue don't go to college but I think we can agree there's some value to good schools. 3. Educ…

I'm doing my part to help with #3. If more people would take direct action, in large numbers, we can move the needle. Identify bureaucracy/obstacles? Route around them.

ps. well said. and extremely agree on #1.

Re: Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups

#55

Post by estevez » Sat, Dec 10, 2011, 12:50 AM UTC

ryanackley wrote: post #41

timjahn wrote: post #18

Throwing $2B at startups isn't going to create a new generation of entrepreneurs. 1. Fix the healthcare system. Right now, you're punished if you don't work for a large company in the sense that you're charged up the wazoo for health insurance. Work for a large company and it's close to free. 2. Fix student loans. One could argue don't go to college but I think we can agree there's some value to good schools. 3. Educ…

fix student loans I put myself through school on a student loan. I was very grateful for it. I was charged a reasonable tax deductible interest rate. So I'm curious about what is actually broken?

The lack of bankruptcy protection comes to mind.

Re: Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups

#56

Post by anigbrowl » Sat, Dec 10, 2011, 12:52 AM UTC

rbanffy wrote: post #53

anigbrowl wrote: post #42

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Congress has to do that, the executive branch can't. To the extent that the executive branch is streamlining the existing immigration system, they're being derided as amnesty-offering traitors by the xenophobic know-nothings that want Berlin Wall 2.0.

Just as a side note, you really don't want an executive branch that can do that (fixing the immigration and patent systems). edit: sorry if it didn't end up as clear as it should

-

Re: Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups

#57

Post by mkramlich » Sat, Dec 10, 2011, 12:55 AM UTC

andrewpi wrote: post #52

ryanackley wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

fix student loans I put myself through school on a student loan. I was very grateful for it. I was charged a reasonable tax deductible interest rate. So I'm curious about what is actually broken?

Massive inflation in tuition in the last 20-30 years.

bingo. plus a wide spread effort and propaganda from higher education proponents that misleads kids into pursuing "no job" degrees. philosophy? communications? women's studies? please. if you're going to spend big bucks, especially fellow tax payer dollars, spend it on something real and non-obvious at least, something you can't just self-educate on at home, in your free time.

Re: Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups

#58

Post by mgkimsal » Sat, Dec 10, 2011, 1:00 AM UTC

HilbertSpace wrote: post #30

shantanubala wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The bailout was a mess, but I feel there's some truth to what Kissenger wrote a while back: basically, a leader will never be given credit for choosing between two evils (a possible crisis, or a poorly-executed bailout) because you will never be able to prove with certainty how bad the other option would have been. We have no way to truly know what things would be like without the bailout, and we really ought to thin…

Some clarity and contact with reality: "The bailout was a mess" The efforts of big gumment to get people who couldn't afford a house into one that blew a housing bubble that popped and created the worst financial and economic disaster since the Great Depression "was a mess". The 'bailout', that is, the TARP program was not "a mess" at all but a grand success: (1) TARP made money. All or nearly all the money has been…

(3) TARP was not a 'bailout' but just to solve a short-term 'liquidity' problem, that is, as in 'runs' on the banks.

Note: A 'liquidity' problem is when you are worth $10 million but have only $500 in cash and suddenly have a traffic ticket for $600 and have to pay up or go to jail right NOW.

You have the money but just don't have it in cash right away; you can get the cash easily enough but will need some days or weeks to do so.

So to solve your 'liquidity' problem, you get a loan using some of your $10 million in assets as collateral. The loan is not really at risk; you pay your $600 bill; then a few weeks later you repay your loan with interest.

You are not broke. You are not begging for welfare. The loan is not a gift. The loan is not at risk. The loan is NOT a 'bailout'.

-------------------------------------------------

What would define a 'bailout' as then?

Your example may be a bit extreme. If you're "worth" $10 million, but don't have $500 in liquid cash, you're stupid. You're not prepared for every day eventualities in your line of work (or just life in general). When people are unprepared for otherwise predictable things (washing machine breaks, you need an oil change, flat tire, etc) they have to suck it up and deal with it. They don't get to tie up all their money in investments and have someone loan them money for 100% foreseeable day to day life realities.

"You have the money but just don't have it in cash right away; you can get the cash easily enough but will need some days or weeks to do so."

I get emails from these guys in Nigeria all the time.

"You are not broke. You are not begging for welfare. The loan is not a gift. The loan is not at risk. The loan is NOT a 'bailout'."

Yes, you are broke. No, you're not begging for welfare. But, the loan is a gift to save you from otherwise going to jail.

When normal people in their every day lives don't have a safety net/cushion/rainy-day-fund to fall back on, they're labelled irresponsible, lazy, deadbeats, or charged with "living beyond their means". But if a bank does it... WTF? It's just normal business?

Re: Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups

#59

Post by mkramlich » Sat, Dec 10, 2011, 1:00 AM UTC

gojomo wrote: post #3

Let a thousand Solyndras bloom! But seriously, exempting smaller firms and fundraising efforts from costly regulations is a good part of this initiative. Routing public funds through private investors, not so much. While they're at it, they should completely eliminate the wealth tests for 'accredited investor' status. If some fig leaf of 'accreditation' is still needed, it should be experience-based or net-worth prop…

> Let a thousand Solyndras bloom!

lots of alt energy companies? you bet. risky? of course. will some fail? always. do people make mistakes? yes. would you prefer instead that a thousand new Wall Street firms bloom? a thousand new oil companies? And Solyndra's cost to taxpayers, and impact on debt, is a tiny tiny drop in the bucket compare to what's been spent on Iraq and Afghanistan, or the Bush tax cuts for the richest Americans. put things in perspective, sorting by amounts, at the very least.

I think we do agree on the idea that we should make it easier, or more meritocratic, to invest. And less bureaucracy. No arguments there. And there's a bill going through Congress now, I believe, and which Obama supports, to help do just that.

Re: Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups

#60

Post by geori » Sat, Dec 10, 2011, 1:03 AM UTC

timjahn wrote: post #18

Throwing $2B at startups isn't going to create a new generation of entrepreneurs. 1. Fix the healthcare system. Right now, you're punished if you don't work for a large company in the sense that you're charged up the wazoo for health insurance. Work for a large company and it's close to free. 2. Fix student loans. One could argue don't go to college but I think we can agree there's some value to good schools. 3. Educ…

On #2, Obama has had a pretty big impact.

A) The democrats pushed through Student Loan reform alongside the healthcare bill last year. "The new law will eliminate fees paid to private banks to act as intermediaries in providing loans to college students and use much of the nearly $68 billion in savings over 11 years to expand Pell Grants and make it easier for students to repay outstanding loans after graduating."

http://thecaucus.blogs.nytimes.com/2010/03/30/obama-signs-bi...

B) A month ago Obama announced a plan to allow college graduates to cap federal student loan repayments at 10 percent of discretionary income starting in January, two years before the cap was due to take effect under federal law.

http://www.washingtonpost.com/blogs/44/post/obama-administra...