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Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups

whitehouse.gov

11–20 of 175 posts

Re: Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups

#11
Laissez faire, telle devrait être la devise de toute puissance publique, depuis que le monde est civilisé ... Détestable principe que celui de ne vouloir grandir que par l'abaissement de nos voisins! Il n'y a que la méchanceté et la malignité du coeur de satisfaites dans ce principe, et l’intérêt y est opposé. Laissez faire, morbleu! Laissez faire!!

(Trans: "Leave it be, that should be the motto of all public powers, as the world is civilized ... That we cannot grow except by lowering our neighbors is a detestable notion! Only malice and malignity of heart is satisfied with such a principle and our (national) interest is opposed to it. Leave it be, for heaven's sake! Leave it be!")

Re: Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups

#12
post #2

$1 trillion for banks, $1 billion for startups, you can really see how important this administration feels startups are. Why not just tell banks, lend half the money we're giving you to startups, instead of using it to prop up your balance sheets.

Where do you get the "$1 trillion for banks" number? The xkcd "money" diagram has a good illustration of this:

http://xkcd.com/980/huge/#x=-10540&y=-4650&z=6

$700 billion was made available. "Only" $400 billion of this was actually spent. It was used to buy so-called toxic assets. Many of those assets were later converted back into cash: half of the $400 billion has already been repaid. Based on the value of the remaining assets, after they get sold and the money returned to the pot, it looks like the cost of TARP will be about $42 billion. That's a lot of money, but far from $1 trillion.

Re: Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups

#15
post #3

Let a thousand Solyndras bloom! But seriously, exempting smaller firms and fundraising efforts from costly regulations is a good part of this initiative. Routing public funds through private investors, not so much. While they're at it, they should completely eliminate the wealth tests for 'accredited investor' status. If some fig leaf of 'accreditation' is still needed, it should be experience-based or net-worth prop…

The problems with proportional would be twofold: 1. How can the company taking the investment verify that the investor doesn't have other Angel investments? Remember: this is most important from a startup perspective to make sure you're able to do clean funding rounds without dealing with the fallout of non-accredited investors. 2. There's nothing to stop people from repeatedly losing 10% (or whatever percent you allow) on stupid gambles.

I'm not convinced that academic credentials would be that useful either. I'd trust someone who's run a plumbing business for ten years far more to evaluate a startup investment than I would your average MBA. I thought it amusing that Swenson talks about university professors as if they are automatically financially sophisticated (one of the few points not backed up by data in Unconventional Success).

Re: Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups

#16
post #12
post #2

$1 trillion for banks, $1 billion for startups, you can really see how important this administration feels startups are. Why not just tell banks, lend half the money we're giving you to startups, instead of using it to prop up your balance sheets.

Where do you get the "$1 trillion for banks" number? The xkcd "money" diagram has a good illustration of this: http://xkcd.com/980/huge/#x=-10540&y=-4650&z=6 $700 billion was made available. "Only" $400 billion of this was actually spent. It was used to buy so-called toxic assets. Many of those assets were later converted back into cash: half of the $400 billion has already been repaid. Based on the value of the rema…

The TARP money was just a payday loan until QE1, QE2, and now QE3 can take effect. Of course the banks paid the money back, they got the money from the discount window for free, which was printed by the gov't printing T-bills. Why stay on TARP when you can borrow money for free and pay TARP back?

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_public_debt Look at the debt expansion which is necessary to directly funnel the money to the banks.

The money goes from the Govt to the Fed who lends it to banks via the discount window, IIRC the rate for the discount window is still 0. The Fed still holds $2 trillion in assets which is up from $500 million pre-2008, there's the $1.2 trillion (and a bit more). The TARP verbiage is just a smoke screen because that's where people will look, so they moved it to the discount window.

I think the graphs over at ZeroHedge that come from Bloomberg terminals are a tad bit more accurate than XKCD, that's just my opinion though.

Re: Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups

#17
post #7

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The bailout was a mess, but I feel there's some truth to what Kissenger wrote a while back: basically, a leader will never be given credit for choosing between two evils (a possible crisis, or a poorly-executed bailout) because you will never be able to prove with certainty how bad the other option would have been. We have no way to truly know what things would be like without the bailout, and we really ought to thin…

Yeah, one is an accounting trick that penalizes everyone who saved money and the other has a serious chance of working. If startups were important they could have just cancelled the V-22 Osprey program which eats $2.8 billion per year, or ballistic missile defense at $9.9 billion, or DHS at $60 billion. $1 billion dollars over three years is probably less money than the gov't spends on toilet cleaning. It's equivalen…

Yes, but these are all separate decisions with their own (opportunity) costs, aren't they?

Think of it this way:

Why would the government invest in Facebook or Twitter when there are plenty of people who already have their wallets open? That goes for many tech startups -- YCombinator alone is very beneficial for the government in an indirect way because the government no longer needs to think about funding tech startups -- someone else is already doing it really well for them.

So the real necessity for government intervention is for extremely risky and potentially extremely unprofitable ventures that allow for amazing possibilities (think NASA when the US was afraid of the Soviets). Pure scientific research is often this way as well.

And even NASA is a small fraction of the federal budget (I remember Neil DeGrasse Tyson repeating "half a penny to a dollar" a lot.

So my point is this: startups, research, or pretty much any economy-advancing investments aren't going to exceed the cost of trying to keep people happy. The War in Iraq is an example: we wouldn't be there if we weren't scared 10 years ago. We wouldn't have been eager to go to war unless it made us feel happier or safer or more content. In contrast, how content do people feel when they hear about a space shuttle explosion? Or money "wasted" on research that could be used to feed the poor?

Why did we even fund NASA again? Oh yeah, we were afraid. The United States collectively didn't give a crap about space until we imagined the Soviets creating the Death Star before us.

I'm not saying any of this is rational. Actually, I really agree with you, but the fact that money is going to startups is a good sign. The quantity is low because nothing will cost more than making people feel happy, safe, and secure right now.

Re: Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups

#18
Throwing $2B at startups isn't going to create a new generation of entrepreneurs.

1. Fix the healthcare system. Right now, you're punished if you don't work for a large company in the sense that you're charged up the wazoo for health insurance. Work for a large company and it's close to free.

2. Fix student loans. One could argue don't go to college but I think we can agree there's some value to good schools.

3. Educate tomorrow's would-be entrepreneurs. A lot of America is taught to go to college and get a job at a large corporation after. Let's shift the perspective. Let kids know that starting your own business is a possibility and not something to be ashamed of.

Re: Obama Announces $2B Fund for Startups

#19
post #3

Let a thousand Solyndras bloom! But seriously, exempting smaller firms and fundraising efforts from costly regulations is a good part of this initiative. Routing public funds through private investors, not so much. While they're at it, they should completely eliminate the wealth tests for 'accredited investor' status. If some fig leaf of 'accreditation' is still needed, it should be experience-based or net-worth prop…

I don't recommend angel investing for anyone who can't afford to lose a fairly substantial amount of money, which pretty much excludes anyone who isn't already an accredited investor. Finding the next Facebook or Google is a lot harder than you might think, and even if you did, they probably don't want your money. You are better off investing in your own self (education and the like).

Eliminating the wealth test would mainly benefit scammers.

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