As a mailing-list bound software professional, this is wonderful news. Maybe one day we will be free of software development on MLs.
What's better than a mailing list?
A mailing list which is 1:1 accessible via a web interface and an NNTP interface.
The Gnome Project is closing all its mailing lists
41–50 of 95 posts
Re: The Gnome Project is closing all its mailing lists
#42Re: The Gnome Project is closing all its mailing lists
#43I love Gnome, they piss some people off by making radical choices, but slowly they keep iterating and coming up with something nice over a long term. They have a vision and stick to it for years. I'm happy they don't just feel offended by posts like yours and act like short term pleasers. It's foss, you can fork it, you can use KDE. you can switch to Windows if you want. That's what free as in freedom is. Personally…
> they piss some people off by making radical choices No, people are not pissed off by the radicality of the choices. Stop taking people for uneducated jokers. People are pissed off because they understand the choices and do not agree with them or what they imply. Gamification, pushing apps and app stores, using the same disempowering concepts as mobile plateforms, changing design every so often for no good reason, f…
I did not interpret "radical" in the prior comment to have either a positive or negative connotation. It merely implies that some of GNOME's decisions are polarizing and a drastic departure from norms, not that people who object to those decisions are "uneducated jokers".
I think it's great that a few open source projects are willing to be more radical and experimental, even if that results in pissing off a large number of reasonable and well-educated people.
The alternative seems to be a kind of milquetoast design-by-committee that satisfies the majority of people but also perpetually plays catch up to proprietary products by recreating their features without ever breaking new ground.
Re: The Gnome Project is closing all its mailing lists
#44Earlier quoted context omitted.
> they piss some people off by making radical choices No, people are not pissed off by the radicality of the choices. Stop taking people for uneducated jokers. People are pissed off because they understand the choices and do not agree with them or what they imply. Gamification, pushing apps and app stores, using the same disempowering concepts as mobile plateforms, changing design every so often for no good reason, f…
The main reason I'm not using Linux at home is exactly updates - I don't want to be bothered for hours figuring out arcane error messages for each and every round of updates. When a distribution will be able to handle updates like the mobile platforms I will reconsider, and until then I'll handle this hassle only at work where I'm paid for it.
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Re: The Gnome Project is closing all its mailing lists
#45I would be happy if projects would convert their mailing lists to newsgroups. They are the perfect forum for discussions. The main benefits being that I can download all the historical messages easily (difficult with mailing lists), and I can use an interface that I am accustomed to no matter the provider (difficult with web forums where each uses their own theme).
Re: The Gnome Project is closing all its mailing lists
#46Earlier quoted context omitted.
> Mailing Lists are decidedly democratic, and have least barrier to entry. Oh no, they are not. I loathe projects that only do mailing list support, because that means I have to subscribe to the mailing list, create a new folder and filter rule so that the mailing list doesn't flood my inbox with stuff I don't care about, and once the problem is solved, leave the mailing list, remove the filter and folder. In contras…
"I have to subscribe to the mailing list, create a new folder and filter rule" That's a workflow problem on your side. Why is it so hard? Maybe your mail user agent isn't configurable? "In contrast,"... "me"... "I"... "I"... "I"... Every one of your proposed advantages are not about the community's health, but about your convenience and ability to ignore the community as a whole. It's fine that you have a preference,…
> Every one of your proposed advantages are not about the community's health, but about your convenience and ability to ignore the community as a whole.
What makes a ML based workflow better for a community?
> It's fine that you have a preference, but claiming that your preference is more democratic is incorrect.
Most development is not done over MLs, that's a fact. The percentage of ML-based development done over time is shrinking. So I'd say the democratic vote is not one in favour of MLs.
Re: The Gnome Project is closing all its mailing lists
#47Re: The Gnome Project is closing all its mailing lists
#48I love Gnome, they piss some people off by making radical choices, but slowly they keep iterating and coming up with something nice over a long term. They have a vision and stick to it for years. I'm happy they don't just feel offended by posts like yours and act like short term pleasers. It's foss, you can fork it, you can use KDE. you can switch to Windows if you want. That's what free as in freedom is. Personally…
Count the number of GNOME forks and the number of KDE forks , then also consider the reason of those forks. Something happen with GNOME3, something that spliting one big community in more smaller ones, I am not sure if the "vision" is good if the first step is to kick out a big chunk of the community that do not agree 100% with your vision and half of your left community is screwing your vision with their unsupported customization. But it happens in other projects too, when big ego gain control, they will not accept they are wrong, then they are kicked out and you get back to normal (google the KDE cachew thingy)
Re: The Gnome Project is closing all its mailing lists
#49Closing mailing lists is another step away from the free Internet. Mailing lists have searchable, multiple, non-centralized archives and are harder to censor.
Discourse is centralized, moderators delete messages, rename and manipulate threads. The inner circle has all the power. Upvotes induce groupthink and cliques.
Re: The Gnome Project is closing all its mailing lists
#50Earlier quoted context omitted.
What's better than a mailing list?
A mailing list which is 1:1 accessible via a web interface and an NNTP interface.
Sure that's better. What would be even better would be support:
- CI integration
- Rich markup, for images etc.
- Simple patch management
- Edits to messages
- Issue tracking