Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it • Hacker News Board

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#171

Post by indypb » Thu, Dec 08, 2011, 9:14 PM UTC

cma wrote: post #81

Xuzz wrote: post #37

See, to me, Samsung does have an issue here, but it's not about the "rounded rectangle" shape or the "reasonably thick black bezel": it's the fact they have both of those, like the iPad, but then also surround them with a marginal silver border. I own both the Galaxy Tab 10.1" and an iPad 2, and I actually do get confused between the two all the time, when looking at them from above. They're about the same thickness…

Black bezel, marginal silver border, years before the iPad, made by Samsung: http://www.blogcdn.com/www.engadget.com/media/2006/1/SAMS.jp...

"slate boards where disappearing gradually circa 1930": http://de.wikipedia.org/w/index.php?title=Datei:Schiefertafe...

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#172

Post by chc » Thu, Dec 08, 2011, 9:19 PM UTC

danilocampos wrote: post #137

Tichy wrote: post #129

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I am sure they did not copy the 21mm because it looks the best. There must be some other reason.

> I am sure they did not copy the 21mm because it looks the best. There must be some other reason. We agree. That reason being, it looks like Apple's, and consumers love that.

No, the reason it's that wide is because that's how wide PDMI cables are. They are all about the same width. It's a standard.

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#173

Post by freehunter » Thu, Dec 08, 2011, 9:21 PM UTC

9oliYQjP wrote: post #67

Apple didn't give design advice to Samsung because they're arrogant. It's because for them to argue that their patents are being infringed, they have to point out alternative designs that could have achieved the same effect. IP laws are screwed up, but a lot of people are jumping on this bandwagon out of ignorance. It's like people who get mad because a brand comes down hard on folks using their trademark. It's a leg…

>they have to point out alternative designs that could have achieved the same effect.

And this post proves that those alternative designs would make for a decidedly unappealing tablet experience. If Apple designs their products to be the bare minimum that looks good, they don't have the right to be surprised when other companies come to the same conclusion.

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#174

Post by r00fus » Thu, Dec 08, 2011, 9:25 PM UTC

danilocampos wrote: post #113

ebzlo wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I hate mini-usb, for some reason the fit has never been good for me. I'm fine with Apple's USB connector being the standard fit for our mobile devices. And this means if someone has a Samsung tablet at their house, I can charge my iPad.

> if someone has a Samsung tablet at their house, I can charge my iPad. Not so much – the cable isn't actually compatible. It just looks like it should be.

This is even worse... it's deceptive. Of course they couldn't make it compatible without paying Apple (who would probably wouldn't have allowed it without egregious licensing fees), but if it looks like it works and doesn't, that's just doing their end-users a disservice.

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#175

Post by Terretta » Thu, Dec 08, 2011, 9:27 PM UTC

freehunter wrote: post #161

webjprgm wrote: post #98

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, it also looks like the border is slightly raised more like the Kindle. This is the form factor that I would have thought of naturally, before seeing the iPad, since it's similar to the designs that existed for computers at the time. Compare it to previous tablets/slates, laptops, Palm pilots, Newton. Most of them have some kind of raised plastic border (and often not black but some shade of gray).

Problem is, the iPad was designed for finger input. Raises bezels would mean you can't touch a segment of the edge of the screen without pressing hard enough to force your finger into that triangle. Any designer working with finger input would recognize that and design a screen flush with the bezel. With previous devices, they were generally designed with a stylus in mind (Palm, Newton, slates, etc). A flush bezel, w…

> "... is a no-brainer when you think about it."

Then it's not really a no brainer, is it? :)

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#176

Post by freehunter » Thu, Dec 08, 2011, 9:28 PM UTC

vecter wrote: post #35

Legion wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There's plenty of use of the color black, rectangular shapes, rounded corners, and centered screens in the "before iPad" group.

And they all run Windows with a stylus. No capacitive touch screen, no custom app-based OS. It's a qualitative difference.

I don't think the design patent covers the software or even the hardware. It's about looks, exclusively.

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#177

Post by freehunter » Thu, Dec 08, 2011, 9:32 PM UTC

jopt wrote: post #63

The author seems to argue that only unsuccessful design is entitled to protection.

No, just that only non-obvious design should be entitled to protection. A thumb-width, neutrally colored bezel, a rectangle screen, and non-lethal corners are obvious. Apple's suggestions are to specifically engineer a device that looks unlike an Apple product, rather than designing a device in the obvious way.

Apple wants to corner the market on simple design. Imagine if your coffee cup couldn't be designed to be round, have a handle that goes from the top to the bottom, or have an opening on the top to drink from.

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#178

Post by protomyth » Thu, Dec 08, 2011, 9:53 PM UTC

I would normally give a company the benefit of the doubt, but after the SGH-i607 (Blackjack)[1] I just assume Samsung is a copy type company for design.

[1] http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Samsung_SGH-i607

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#179

Post by Gring » Thu, Dec 08, 2011, 10:05 PM UTC

Helianthus wrote: post #118

ianstormtaylor wrote: post #109

This article is fraught with frustratingly-incorrect use of the word "design". The author continually mistakes "design" for visual appearance. "Apple never designed the iPad. They undesigned the tablet. They focused on creating the simplest form possible. Every single decision is based on usability, readability, comfort, and focusing your eyes on the content itself." That's exactly what design is: finding the problem…

I'm furious over the use of the 'word' "undesign." THEY'RE DESTROYING MY LANGUAGE.

Actually, they're undesigning your language.

Re: Apple Never Designed the iPad - They Undesigned it

#180

Post by tikhonj » Thu, Dec 08, 2011, 10:10 PM UTC

roadnottaken wrote: post #14

It is not so simple. Tablet computers before the iPad did not look anything like the iPad: http://osxdaily.com/2011/08/18/tablet-design-before-after-th... in hindsight , it seems like the only completely obvious way to design a tablet, but that fact in itself is the mark of great design.

That picture, which is shown much too often, is a perfect illustration only of selection bias.

Going through past tablets and choosing the ones that were not black rectangles proves nothing except that some tablets did not look like the ipad. Some tablets now also don't look like the ipad.