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Ask HN: How bad is hiring going to be within the next year?

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Re: Ask HN: How bad is hiring going to be within the next year?

#21

Post by perspective3 »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #17

> If this were a year ago, I'd feel good; grind some leetcode, get hired at a big tech company for a good salary. This dynamic is one of the reasons we're seeing such large layoffs right now. Even many of the companies that are rolling in cash simply got too aggressive with hiring in recent years. Anyone who knew the drill could grind leetcode, study interview guides, apply to enough FAANG companies and get a job eve…

> Anyone who knew the drill could grind leetcode, study interview guides, apply to enough FAANG companies and get a job eventually.

It's ironic that the trackpants set that got into leetcoding over medicine because the lifestyle was better are now getting fucked by the fact that if you're doing useless shit in programming, you truly will get fired and fucked.

At least if you grind in medicine, you are helping people. That said, the lifestyle options like radiology that those same trackpants kids get into will have their comeuppance too, just in longer time scales.

Re: Ask HN: How bad is hiring going to be within the next year?

#22

Post by UltimateFloofy »

perspective3 wrote: post #21
PragmaticPulp wrote: post #17

> If this were a year ago, I'd feel good; grind some leetcode, get hired at a big tech company for a good salary. This dynamic is one of the reasons we're seeing such large layoffs right now. Even many of the companies that are rolling in cash simply got too aggressive with hiring in recent years. Anyone who knew the drill could grind leetcode, study interview guides, apply to enough FAANG companies and get a job eve…

> Anyone who knew the drill could grind leetcode, study interview guides, apply to enough FAANG companies and get a job eventually. It's ironic that the trackpants set that got into leetcoding over medicine because the lifestyle was better are now getting fucked by the fact that if you're doing useless shit in programming, you truly will get fired and fucked. At least if you grind in medicine, you are helping people.…

but healthtech is doing pretty well!

Re: Ask HN: How bad is hiring going to be within the next year?

#23

Post by everfrustrated »

abraxas wrote: post #13
mariojv wrote: post #5

I don't know your personal situation, but the way I interpret things is kind of like this: - FAANG got bloated during the bubble and anticipated growth that isn't materializing as fast, so they're cutting headcount. Similar for other big non-FAANG public companies. - Down stock market means that public companies can't get as much capital for new investment by selling shares. - High interest rates increase cost of deb…

For software engineering 2001 especially post 9/11 was brutal. Much more so than 2008 unless you worked for a financial company. 2008/2009 was lean times but good people were able to find work. After the dotcom bust however, things were so bad I had a friend who is a very good developer who spent a couple of years gluing shoes for a living. In Canada.

While this is true, 22 years on the tech industry is a very different size. It could play out differently.

Re: Ask HN: How bad is hiring going to be within the next year?

#24

Post by thisiswrongggg »

jcadam wrote: post #12

I remember 2008. Workplaces get increasingly cutthroat when layoffs start looming. Coworkers sabotaging each other, whole teams trying to make other teams look bad, etc.

I don't think they ever got out of this stage TBH. Workplaces are getting more toxic as years go by IME.

Re: Ask HN: How bad is hiring going to be within the next year?

#25

Post by ss108 »

PragmaticPulp wrote: post #17

> If this were a year ago, I'd feel good; grind some leetcode, get hired at a big tech company for a good salary. This dynamic is one of the reasons we're seeing such large layoffs right now. Even many of the companies that are rolling in cash simply got too aggressive with hiring in recent years. Anyone who knew the drill could grind leetcode, study interview guides, apply to enough FAANG companies and get a job eve…

>In your case, "used to be a software engineer" is already going to put you at a massive disadvantage relative to all of the experienced engineers who were recently forced into the job market by layoffs.

No doubt. Luckily, I did actually do some job searching for dev jobs from March - May this year, and I did get interviews, etc., so hopefully the situation for me isn't that dire so long as I can perform.

Whether my doing a startup while employed at my last job is seen as a negative is going to be really up to them, but all I can do is assure them I am not continuing. Luckily, this has made me a competent dev again.

The honest truth is I would feel pretty happy to be free of both the biglaw job and the startup (I believe in the idea, but it's difficult, especially with another full-time job, Jesus it's getting unsustainable), and would love to just focus on being a software engineer again, and would have a level of gratitude for the job that would outstrip most other candidates. But they have nothing to go off of as to all that aside from my word.

Re: Ask HN: How bad is hiring going to be within the next year?

#26

Post by PragmaticPulp »

PM_me_your_math wrote: post #8
PaulHoule wrote: post #2

I am hearing a lot about layoffs at "FAANG", Intel, Twitter and a few other employers that are notoriously bloated. (e.g I wouldn't take layoffs at Intel as an economic indicator because Intel seems to lay 10,000 engineers off every few years because of its own perversity) More normal sorts of employers are still reporting extreme problems hiring people. For instance I was late for work this morning because the bus w…

I had a friend who would say that 10% of the workforce keeps the company running, while another 10% support them; whereas, the remainder role-play giving presentations to each other.

> I had a friend who would say that 10% of the workforce keeps the company running, while another 10% support them; whereas, the remainder role-play giving presentations to each other.

That's what it feels like when you're at the bottom of the org chart

But I've worked in a few large businesses that had a lot of people doing work on the front lines. It ends up being more like 10% of the company in management. Most of our time was spent rushing to keep the front-line workers happy.

When jobs are relatively interchangeable (e.g. a warehouse worker can quit their job today and start at a new warehouse tomorrow) you actually have to work really, really hard to avoid upsetting those front line employees. I worked through some convoluted business/engineering problems just to avoid making front-line workers the least bit troubled in their jobs. I know this is polar opposite of the stereotype, but it's especially true in tight hiring markets like the one we're currently in.

Re: Ask HN: How bad is hiring going to be within the next year?

#27

Post by Buttons840 »

Most of us have been writing software that takes two developers to maintain - exponential growth.

There's always down times, but companies will want to get those huge inefficient enterprise software cogs moving again soon. The siren call of how great things could be if only the software was good are too tempting.

Re: Ask HN: How bad is hiring going to be within the next year?

#28

Post by jcadam »

thisiswrongggg wrote: post #24
jcadam wrote: post #12

I remember 2008. Workplaces get increasingly cutthroat when layoffs start looming. Coworkers sabotaging each other, whole teams trying to make other teams look bad, etc.

I don't think they ever got out of this stage TBH. Workplaces are getting more toxic as years go by IME.

You have a point. Another reason to prefer remote work.

Re: Ask HN: How bad is hiring going to be within the next year?

#29

Post by myth_drannon »

abraxas wrote: post #13
mariojv wrote: post #5

I don't know your personal situation, but the way I interpret things is kind of like this: - FAANG got bloated during the bubble and anticipated growth that isn't materializing as fast, so they're cutting headcount. Similar for other big non-FAANG public companies. - Down stock market means that public companies can't get as much capital for new investment by selling shares. - High interest rates increase cost of deb…

For software engineering 2001 especially post 9/11 was brutal. Much more so than 2008 unless you worked for a financial company. 2008/2009 was lean times but good people were able to find work. After the dotcom bust however, things were so bad I had a friend who is a very good developer who spent a couple of years gluing shoes for a living. In Canada.

I spent some time working as a secuirty guard (while a student) after dotcome bust. Half of my coworkers were laid off software developers.

Re: Ask HN: How bad is hiring going to be within the next year?

#30

Post by cvhashim »

abraxas wrote: post #13
mariojv wrote: post #5

I don't know your personal situation, but the way I interpret things is kind of like this: - FAANG got bloated during the bubble and anticipated growth that isn't materializing as fast, so they're cutting headcount. Similar for other big non-FAANG public companies. - Down stock market means that public companies can't get as much capital for new investment by selling shares. - High interest rates increase cost of deb…

For software engineering 2001 especially post 9/11 was brutal. Much more so than 2008 unless you worked for a financial company. 2008/2009 was lean times but good people were able to find work. After the dotcom bust however, things were so bad I had a friend who is a very good developer who spent a couple of years gluing shoes for a living. In Canada.

Tech is such an important facet of our lives these days the amount of work to do outweighs whatever was around in the early 2000s.
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