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The Rise of ‘Luxury Surveillance’

theatlantic.com

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Re: The Rise of ‘Luxury Surveillance’

#21

Post by anigbrowl »

slightly off topic, but:

Growing up in Detroit under the specter of the police unit STRESS—an acronym for “Stop the Robberies, Enjoy Safe Streets”

...am I the only one heartily sick of propagandistic backronyms? The branding of public policy is a disturbing (and long-running) symptom of institutional capture. This example is particularly totalitarian, inflicting a reminder of STRESS on an entire community.

Of course, the excuse is that 'it's just meant to create stress for the criminals.' We should be looking at outcomes, since intentions are unfalsifiable.

Re: The Rise of ‘Luxury Surveillance’

#22

Post by DennisP »

pooper wrote: post #4
adolph wrote: post #2

I hope this doesn't get flagged, although I thought to flag it about a quarter of the way in. Essentially the thesis is that people opting into personal surveillance are changing norms, changes that will be misused by state and employer power against people who don't opt in. Hidden below all of this is the normalization of surveillance that consistently targets marginalized communities. The difference between a smart…

I haven't read the article but I think the outrage is misplaced. There are people forced to wear a Islamic head dress. The solution is not to ban Islamic head dress. There are people forced into sex slavery and prostitution. The solution isn't to ban prostitution. There are people who are forced into an abortion. The solution is not to ban abortion. The solution to abuse cannot be curtailing of rights.

What about my neighbor's Ring doorbell, pointed at my front door from across the street?

Re: The Rise of ‘Luxury Surveillance’

#23

Post by nonameiguess »

infogulch wrote: post #11
adolph wrote: post #2

I hope this doesn't get flagged, although I thought to flag it about a quarter of the way in. Essentially the thesis is that people opting into personal surveillance are changing norms, changes that will be misused by state and employer power against people who don't opt in. Hidden below all of this is the normalization of surveillance that consistently targets marginalized communities. The difference between a smart…

> The difference between a smartwatch and an ankle monitor ... The real difference is who can access and control the generated data . An ankle monitor's purpose is explicitly to send your location history to the government. A smartwatch's purpose is ostensibly to help you record your activities so you can analyze and optimize your life, which on its own is not unreasonable, but in reality there is little separating t…

It's not even close to practically the same. What is the actual rate at which the government subpoenas smartwatch location history and the probability it will happen to you? This is like saying the fact the government has the capability to imprison or shoot you at any time and you would not be able to stop them is exactly the same as actually being imprisoned or executed.

But yes, clearly the best way forward is individual data sovereignty. The reason intelligent personal digital assistants that knew you intimately didn't seem dystopian when they were in Star Trek is because nobody then envisioned that the software and data would be running on corporate servers. We envisioned these things being more along the lines of trusted friends in their own right, with a clear data boundary at the physical limit of the sensing devices they used, not that they would be perpetually networked and owned by third parties like Amazon. They weren't supposed to share information with anyone but you.

Re: The Rise of ‘Luxury Surveillance’

#24

Post by 2OEH8eoCRo0 »

infogulch wrote: post #11
adolph wrote: post #2

I hope this doesn't get flagged, although I thought to flag it about a quarter of the way in. Essentially the thesis is that people opting into personal surveillance are changing norms, changes that will be misused by state and employer power against people who don't opt in. Hidden below all of this is the normalization of surveillance that consistently targets marginalized communities. The difference between a smart…

> The difference between a smartwatch and an ankle monitor ... The real difference is who can access and control the generated data . An ankle monitor's purpose is explicitly to send your location history to the government. A smartwatch's purpose is ostensibly to help you record your activities so you can analyze and optimize your life, which on its own is not unreasonable, but in reality there is little separating t…

> A smartwatch's purpose is ostensibly to help you record your activities so you can analyze and optimize your life

It's an additional megacorp data collection tendril that they let you use a fraction of.

Re: The Rise of ‘Luxury Surveillance’

#25

Post by [deleted] »

sokoloff wrote: post #10
ewzimm wrote: post #5

If there were an Amazon Prison option, I wonder how many people would choose it. Need to serve time? Skip the cell and stay home with a robust suite of real-time behavior analytics to ensure compliance. Conversations are processed locally and scanned for restricted subjects with advanced AI. A special Amazon Prison store offers a full suite of approved products with automatic payments, accessible with Alexa, and cust…

If I had the choice to serve a sentence in real prison or Amazon Prison, I’m 100% on Team Jassy.

[deleted]

Re: The Rise of ‘Luxury Surveillance’

#26

Post by Xylakant »

DennisP wrote: post #22
pooper wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't read the article but I think the outrage is misplaced. There are people forced to wear a Islamic head dress. The solution is not to ban Islamic head dress. There are people forced into sex slavery and prostitution. The solution isn't to ban prostitution. There are people who are forced into an abortion. The solution is not to ban abortion. The solution to abuse cannot be curtailing of rights.

What about my neighbor's Ring doorbell, pointed at my front door from across the street?

Rules in germany are that you can have video surveillance, but it must not cover public spaces. A ring doorbell monitoring your porch is fine, recoding the sidewalk not. Now, enforcement is another issue, but the rules make sense.

Re: The Rise of ‘Luxury Surveillance’

#27

Post by dpflan »

ewzimm wrote: post #5

If there were an Amazon Prison option, I wonder how many people would choose it. Need to serve time? Skip the cell and stay home with a robust suite of real-time behavior analytics to ensure compliance. Conversations are processed locally and scanned for restricted subjects with advanced AI. A special Amazon Prison store offers a full suite of approved products with automatic payments, accessible with Alexa, and cust…

Maybe "Amazon Prism" (a "Prime" members' version of "prison") has a catchier ring to it...

Re: The Rise of ‘Luxury Surveillance’

#28

Post by radicaldreamer »

nostrademons wrote: post #20
radicaldreamer wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why would you not choose this over what prison is currently like? This is like asking whether people would prefer home confinement to being in a prison cell

Interestingly the state has an incentive to take this approach too: it's much cheaper. If you can monitor & enforce confinement without actually building any prisons, you don't need to budget for prisons, you don't need to operate prisons (or contract out to them), and you can avoid the political blowback of the prison/industrial complex. The limiting case for this is the Matrix or Metaverse, where everybody voluntar…

The state, unfortunately, does not have a great incentive to reduce costs; especially since a lot of prisons are run by for-profit entities.

Re: The Rise of ‘Luxury Surveillance’

#29

Post by unreal37 »

DennisP wrote: post #22
pooper wrote: post #4

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't read the article but I think the outrage is misplaced. There are people forced to wear a Islamic head dress. The solution is not to ban Islamic head dress. There are people forced into sex slavery and prostitution. The solution isn't to ban prostitution. There are people who are forced into an abortion. The solution is not to ban abortion. The solution to abuse cannot be curtailing of rights.

What about my neighbor's Ring doorbell, pointed at my front door from across the street?

That is illegal in some countries. For instance in Portugal, you can't film roads or other people's private property. So "car dashcams" are illegal. And any surveillance cameras you have on your property cannot be pointed at someone else's property.

https://europe-cities.com/2022/09/12/the-use-of-%E2%80%B3das...

Re: The Rise of ‘Luxury Surveillance’

#30

Post by wnoise »

infogulch wrote: post #11
adolph wrote: post #2

I hope this doesn't get flagged, although I thought to flag it about a quarter of the way in. Essentially the thesis is that people opting into personal surveillance are changing norms, changes that will be misused by state and employer power against people who don't opt in. Hidden below all of this is the normalization of surveillance that consistently targets marginalized communities. The difference between a smart…

> The difference between a smartwatch and an ankle monitor ... The real difference is who can access and control the generated data . An ankle monitor's purpose is explicitly to send your location history to the government. A smartwatch's purpose is ostensibly to help you record your activities so you can analyze and optimize your life, which on its own is not unreasonable, but in reality there is little separating t…

I don't see a feasible way to ensure individual sovereignty over data you generate, without more regulation.
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