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No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

ccc.de

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Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#101

Post by Defitio »

wink wrote: post #70
Defitio wrote: post #65

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm German too and at least here in Munich you still have to wear masks in lots of settings. Public transport, doctors office, in my work office etc. And the discussion around Oktoberfest was quite often in the media. I'm not sure what you mean by 'no one cares about COVID anymore'.

Mask usage has gone down to... I'd say 20-30% in the supermarkets I frequent, but I don't think it's completely wrong with the implied exaggeration for effect.

I sometimes forget it with the superttoo but I do t want to be counted as not caring.

I'm not sure this exaggeration paints the right picture.

At least in public transport is very visible

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#102

Post by fhars »

crazytalk wrote: post #90
usrusr wrote: post #78

Earlier quoted context omitted.

No, not at all. But the entirety of CCC isn't "normal", C3 isn't just some command line Oktoberfest. CCC identifies a lot with greater-good responsibility and that's not really compatible with the position of "I'll pretend the pandemic does not exist unless authorities force my hand" that a commercial event organizer would take.

[flagged]

You are the one trying to force your partisan view on the volunteers who didn't want to risk their health for an event that probably wouldn't be fun anyway due to likely COVID restrictions.

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#103

Post by GekkePrutser »

qwertox wrote: post #32
mnd999 wrote: post #20

Is it normal in Germany to still be cancelling large events due to Covid? That certainly isn't the case in the UK and hasn't been for some time.

No, it is not normal. CCC is being proactive in that they believe that there is a chance of having the same problems as in the last congress, and they want to avoid this, because volunteers are more hesitant to get involved in a risky situation compared to employees.

Also this is a mostly volunteer organization with a limited budget. The cost is kept very low (so everyone who wants to can participate) and no profit is made.

Very likely the go/nogo point to commit to large expenses (eg venue hire) is now and these would not be refundable. Yet participants would expect to be refunded.

Any financial reserves would already be strained by now. Making it a risk for the survival of the organization if it would have to be cancelled again.

And IMO an event with forced masks or other heavy-handed measures would not be worth it. And Germany is very quick to go for mandatory measures compared to other countries.

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#104

Post by odiroot »

mnd999 wrote: post #20

Is it normal in Germany to still be cancelling large events due to Covid? That certainly isn't the case in the UK and hasn't been for some time.

I was surprised, having recently visited a hospital here in England, to find I'm the only one wearing a mask.

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#105

Post by GekkePrutser »

lagrange77 wrote: post #94
mnd999 wrote: post #20

Is it normal in Germany to still be cancelling large events due to Covid? That certainly isn't the case in the UK and hasn't been for some time.

For me it sends the message: We actually believe in science and scientist predict high covid numbers for the timeframe. In contrast to others, who act completely surprised, when the predictions come true.

High numbers are not a problem if the healthcare is not overwhelmed. The cases have been ever less severe and even last winter the measures were much tougher than needed.

We can't always keep walking on our toes because something might happen.

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#106

Post by Beta-7 »

formerly_proven wrote: post #4

I feel like it may have been a better idea to move the congress to some time in the summer, because public health restrictions in the winter don't seem to go away. We've had vaccines since early 2021, and the 2021 winter still had restrictions, now we're two years down the road and looking at another wave and another restricted winter. I don't see how it's going to be substantially different for the 2023 winter unles…

The Chaos Communication Camp happens in the summer.

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#107

Post by superkuh »

elif wrote: post #73
pantalaimon wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Do you think the COVID situation will be any different in 2023?

It is possible that we will have a viable universal sarbecovirus vaccine by then.

Or an effective intranasal sars-cov-2 specific vaccines that provides good protection from infection/spread in the upper respiratory mucosa. This is to complement the strong protection against serious disease in the body serum/lower lungs that intramuscular vaccines give.

I have high hopes for India's now approved (positive phase 3 trials) adenovirus based one even if astrozenacca's rushed repackaging of theirs as intranasal failed.

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#108

Post by fhars »

DocTomoe wrote: post #16
detaro wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Congress was not cancelled due to any government rule.

Congress was cancelled in anticipation of government rules. It says so in the announcement.

No, it was cancelled in anticipation of a new COVID wave that would make a strict hygiene concept necessary, and bacause most of the volunteers wouldn't want to attend such an event. That these measures might also become mandatory was only an additional aspect, but not decisive at all.

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#109

Post by nivenkos »

happyopossum wrote: post #96
dividedbyzero wrote: post #53

I get why they do it. Oktoberfest in Munich led to a big Covid surge with hospitals filling up at a dangerous rate, and experience tells that December will be worse, so their event would almost certainly be severely downsized or altogether disallowed by the authorities. Renewed Covid restrictions are already being debated in German politics with the general expectation being that some restrictions like masks and less…

> Oktoberfest in Munich led to a big Covid surge with hospitals filling up at a dangerous rate I'm not seeing any evidence anywhere that there were 'dangerous' rates of hospitalizations, unless you consider any increase 'dangerous'. Have any facts to back that up, or is it hyperbole?

All I could find was https://www.tagesspiegel.de/die-patienten-stapeln-sich-in-de...

Which is far from convincing.

You can bet the government will jump on it to suppress the growing energy crisis, anti-war and cost-of-living protests though.

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#110

Post by lagrange77 »

pantalaimon wrote: post #26
fahrradflucht wrote: post #24

Earlier quoted context omitted.

In Germany the hospitalization rates is what now indicates Covid protection measures and they surged in recent weeks.

The official numbers: https://www.rki.de/DE/Content/InfAZ/N/Neuartiges_Coronavirus...

Do i interpret it correctly, that the hospitalization is at it's all time high right now?
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