No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023 • Hacker News Board

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#41

Post by F30 » Tue, Oct 18, 2022, 1:30 PM UTC

Fnoord wrote: post #33

avian wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was at a conference with around 1000 attendees in Germany this summer. The organizers put out a lot of recommendations for visitors regarding Covid (wear masks, be vaccinated, test yourself before and after the event, etc.), but none could be enforced on site since there was no legal basis for it. The result was that precautions were largely ignored by everyone at the event. The aftermath was that the entira orga t…

> (wear masks, be vaccinated, test yourself before and after the event, etc.) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > The result was that precautions were largely ignored by everyone at the event. You don't know if the attendees were vaccinated. You don't know if/how they tested. When I got vaccinated, and also when there wasn't a wave, I got more lax. It requires focus and attention span to follow the precautions. Except for vaccination. T…

> Masks primary role is to ensure you don't spread COVID, not that you don't contract it.

Not true for FFP2s, N95s, and the likes. Which are more common in Germany than in most other places.

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#42

Post by kuschku » Tue, Oct 18, 2022, 1:30 PM UTC

mnd999 wrote: post #20

Is it normal in Germany to still be cancelling large events due to Covid? That certainly isn't the case in the UK and hasn't been for some time.

It's normal for event organizers to still be careful and limit and/or cancel events. There's little government action on this nowadays (although there might be some more enforcement this winter).

Germany is (sadly) not running a China-style Zero Covid plan.

Especially considering the chaos congress was, even before covid, known for the "hacker pest", a type of flu that pretty much every attendee would contract due to bringing together so many people from different regions for a week (also known as cccebola). The organizers want to avoid the same occuring with BA.5 or an even newer Covid variant.

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#43

Post by thaeli » Tue, Oct 18, 2022, 1:32 PM UTC

Fnoord wrote: post #33

avian wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was at a conference with around 1000 attendees in Germany this summer. The organizers put out a lot of recommendations for visitors regarding Covid (wear masks, be vaccinated, test yourself before and after the event, etc.), but none could be enforced on site since there was no legal basis for it. The result was that precautions were largely ignored by everyone at the event. The aftermath was that the entira orga t…

> (wear masks, be vaccinated, test yourself before and after the event, etc.) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > The result was that precautions were largely ignored by everyone at the event. You don't know if the attendees were vaccinated. You don't know if/how they tested. When I got vaccinated, and also when there wasn't a wave, I got more lax. It requires focus and attention span to follow the precautions. Except for vaccination. T…

A tight fitting (in occupational health this means "proved via fit testing") N95/FFP2 or higher filtering facepiece respirator is excellent protection for the wearer regardless of what anyone else is or isn't wearing. Assuming of course that the wearer doesn't remove the mask to eat something, etc.

Masks, which can be loose fitting and have lower filtration performance, are where you really need everyone wearing them since they perform best as source control. But for those who want to be more cautious, wearing a N95 class "mask" (FFR) even if others around you are not masking is still highly effective.

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#44

Post by rsynnott » Tue, Oct 18, 2022, 1:32 PM UTC

rjzzleep wrote: post #23

mnd999 wrote: post #20

Is it normal in Germany to still be cancelling large events due to Covid? That certainly isn't the case in the UK and hasn't been for some time.

[flagged]

> The current health minister kept saying how there are no negative side effects whatsoever from the AZ vaccine until it was finally pulled off the market in Germany.

While I'm not familiar with the reasoning in Germany, in general in most countries the AZ vaccine has been discontinued (or at least largely discontinued; most places still use it for people who are allergic to an ingredient shared by the mRNA ones) because it is less effective than the mRNA ones, and believed to be _much_ less effective for Omicron.

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#45

Post by dagw » Tue, Oct 18, 2022, 1:33 PM UTC

Fnoord wrote: post #33

avian wrote: post #29

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I was at a conference with around 1000 attendees in Germany this summer. The organizers put out a lot of recommendations for visitors regarding Covid (wear masks, be vaccinated, test yourself before and after the event, etc.), but none could be enforced on site since there was no legal basis for it. The result was that precautions were largely ignored by everyone at the event. The aftermath was that the entira orga t…

> (wear masks, be vaccinated, test yourself before and after the event, etc.) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > The result was that precautions were largely ignored by everyone at the event. You don't know if the attendees were vaccinated. You don't know if/how they tested. When I got vaccinated, and also when there wasn't a wave, I got more lax. It requires focus and attention span to follow the precautions. Except for vaccination. T…

The more plausible explanations that you don't got COVID

How you got to/from the conference is also a huge factor. Spending a lot of time in packed airplanes and crowded international terminals are probably at least as big a risk factor as the conference itself.

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#46

Post by TazeTSchnitzel » Tue, Oct 18, 2022, 1:34 PM UTC

rerx wrote: post #40

Fnoord wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> (wear masks, be vaccinated, test yourself before and after the event, etc.) ^^^^^^^^^^^^^ > The result was that precautions were largely ignored by everyone at the event. You don't know if the attendees were vaccinated. You don't know if/how they tested. When I got vaccinated, and also when there wasn't a wave, I got more lax. It requires focus and attention span to follow the precautions. Except for vaccination. T…

FFP2 / N95 masks surely massively reduce the personal risk of infection if they are fitted properly and not taken of.

Even a poorly fitted one is going to do a lot more than wearing nothing.

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#47

Post by tinus_hn » Tue, Oct 18, 2022, 1:46 PM UTC

avian wrote: post #29

mnd999 wrote: post #20

Is it normal in Germany to still be cancelling large events due to Covid? That certainly isn't the case in the UK and hasn't been for some time.

I was at a conference with around 1000 attendees in Germany this summer. The organizers put out a lot of recommendations for visitors regarding Covid (wear masks, be vaccinated, test yourself before and after the event, etc.), but none could be enforced on site since there was no legal basis for it. The result was that precautions were largely ignored by everyone at the event. The aftermath was that the entira orga t…

> a) FFP2 masks work - I strictly wore one indoors and didn't get sick

Great! So if people are still afraid of catching COVID, they can just protect themselves with the masks. Problem solved.

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#48

Post by schroeding » Tue, Oct 18, 2022, 1:47 PM UTC

rsynnott wrote: post #39

mnd999 wrote: post #20

Is it normal in Germany to still be cancelling large events due to Covid? That certainly isn't the case in the UK and hasn't been for some time.

The CCC event is a _very_ large (about 20k people, I think?), crowded, indoor event during Peak Hospital Strain season, so it's fairly close to a worst case.

Even in normal times, there was always tongue-in-cheek the concept of the "Kongressseuche" (congress plague), because many people got (mildly) ill with a cold or the flu. :)

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#49

Post by dividedbyzero » Tue, Oct 18, 2022, 1:49 PM UTC

TazeTSchnitzel wrote: post #46

rerx wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

FFP2 / N95 masks surely massively reduce the personal risk of infection if they are fitted properly and not taken of.

Even a poorly fitted one is going to do a lot more than wearing nothing.

I believe there was a study ranking masks' protective value for the wearer as: tight-fitting FFP2/N95 > surgical mask > FFP2/N95 with bad fit (since they are so dense that you're effectively breathing unfiltered air through the gaps unless there is a tight-ish seal)

Re: No Congress 2022: Looking forward to decentralized alternatives and Camp 2023

#50

Post by skytreader » Tue, Oct 18, 2022, 1:52 PM UTC

Unfortunate :(

I moved to Germany (and Europe) in 2019. I was planning to attend conferences/tech gatherings like this that were previously prohibitive for me once I got settled in but then 2020 had other plans for the world.

It was a bit late when I realized this year that conferences and big gatherings are back. Unfortunately the ones I would've attended (PyCon, We Are Developers) were in conflict with other things like a concert that I already paid for.

This would've been the first opportunity without a conflict for me. Shame although I can understand (and even sympathize with) the organizers' prudence.