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If ghosts could speak, their speech would approximate this key (1778)

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Re: If ghosts could speak, their speech would approximate this key (1778)

#51

Post by rthomas6 »

thechao wrote: post #49
rthomas6 wrote: post #45

Here is some context behind musical tuning systems, and how harmony works: Musical harmony in Western music is based on physical properties of the way materials vibrate. When you vibrate something resonant through plucking, striking, forcing air through, etc, it vibrates at a fundamental frequency, and integer multiples of that fundamental frequency. So for instance 400 Hz, 800 Hz, 1200 Hz, etc. The power of two mult…

Could I get some clarification? > Divide that back down below 800 to 600 Do you mean "keep dividing 1200 by 2 until it is less than 400 times 2"? So, if I have a starting frequency N and some multiple frequency KN then the process is "find i such that ( KN >> i ) N "?

Yes, because remember, humans hear frequency doubling as an octave pitch change. So 1200 divided or multiplied by any multiple of 2 sounds like the same note. You are finding the note in between N and 2N, to find the version of the note in the same octave, to approximate your scale note to.

Re: If ghosts could speak, their speech would approximate this key (1778)

#52

Post by rthomas6 »

rdlw wrote: post #50
rthomas6 wrote: post #45

Here is some context behind musical tuning systems, and how harmony works: Musical harmony in Western music is based on physical properties of the way materials vibrate. When you vibrate something resonant through plucking, striking, forcing air through, etc, it vibrates at a fundamental frequency, and integer multiples of that fundamental frequency. So for instance 400 Hz, 800 Hz, 1200 Hz, etc. The power of two mult…

> The even-indexed (starting at 1) multiples sound like the same note in a higher octave Actually, the power of two multiples sound like the same note.

Oops, you are right! I edited my comment.

Re: If ghosts could speak, their speech would approximate this key (1778)

#55

Post by bigtech »

rgrieselhuber wrote: post #48
arxanas wrote: post #2

Keep in mind that under equal temperament, used ubiquitously today, all keys sound the same. The descriptions in the article probably only apply to a certain other tuning system. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Key_(music)#Key_coloration

Assuming that well-tempered would be the primary alternative here, does it enable one to differentiate between keys? Asking as someone with very little experience / knowledge of music theory.

It's an interesting history, better explained here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/12_equal_temperament but in short, prior tuning systems were more mathematically correct, but an instrument would be tuned for a particular key and playing in other keys would sound (to us, anyway) like the instrument was out of tune.

Re: If ghosts could speak, their speech would approximate this key (1778)

#56

Post by rgrieselhuber »

bigtech wrote: post #55
rgrieselhuber wrote: post #48

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Assuming that well-tempered would be the primary alternative here, does it enable one to differentiate between keys? Asking as someone with very little experience / knowledge of music theory.

It's an interesting history, better explained here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/12_equal_temperament but in short, prior tuning systems were more mathematically correct, but an instrument would be tuned for a particular key and playing in other keys would sound (to us, anyway) like the instrument was out of tune.

But if a piece was written for a specific key and the instrument was tuned to that key for that piece, that would be both more mathematically correct and also matching the original intent of the composer? What is the rationale for equal temperament?

Re: If ghosts could speak, their speech would approximate this key (1778)

#57

Post by thenoblesunfish »

arxanas wrote: post #2

Keep in mind that under equal temperament, used ubiquitously today, all keys sound the same. The descriptions in the article probably only apply to a certain other tuning system. See https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Key_(music)#Key_coloration

To say more, since people are asking: equal temperment means that you take an octave and divide it into 12 pitches, so that the ratio of each pitch to the next is the same (the 12th root of 2). When you play in a major key, you pick a particular set of 7 of those 12, with a particular set of "skips". You can get from one major scale to another one by multiplying all the frequencies by the same scaling (some power of the 12th root of 2). Notice that in that major scale, for instance, the frequency between notes 1 and 7 is close to, but not exactly 3/2. It's in some sense out of tune. Back in the day it was more common for pianos to not be in equal temperment. One advantage might be that you could, in some key, have notes 1 and 7 be closer to a ratio of 3/2. But this means that the same scale in different keys would have different ratios of frequencies! That's how they would sound different.

Re: If ghosts could speak, their speech would approximate this key (1778)

#58

Post by atoav »

jefftk wrote: post #40
atoav wrote: post #15

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't have perfect pitch, but I play a fretless instrument and this means I can hear the distances and relations between notes very clearly. I still however feel drawn to certain frequencies even without reference or other instrument playing and those frequencies I am drawn to are actual notes. I know 440 Hz is somewhat arbitrary sure, but 99% of the music we hear is somewhat referenced to it. To me there is certai…

> It happened more than once to me that some instrument had been detuned a semitone up or down and I noticed because the resulting music felt different. I suspect this is you having some amount of absolute pitch? It's pretty common! What's rare is reliably and quickly identifying pitches without a reference, though even this can often be learned with practice.

I just might. Although I also have a deep love for microtonal or otherwise non-equal tempered music (even accidenrally detuned instrument can sound very great and interesting at times).
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