Don't Be A Free User • Hacker News Board

Re: Don't Be A Free User

#91

Post by jimbobimbo » Wed, Dec 07, 2011, 1:12 AM UTC

DanielBMarkham wrote: post #58

This article brings up a good point: if you just found some super-cool free web application that you love? Odds are the only thing you're doing when you use it and recommend it to your friends is creating a nice resume for some large company to do a "talent acquisition" Large companies love this -- they find a couple of guys who are able to identify and engage audiences and then they kill their product and stick them…

"Pump and dump" entrepreneurialism" - ah, beautiful! Thank you for this description!

Re: Don't Be A Free User

#92

Post by jarek » Wed, Dec 07, 2011, 1:19 AM UTC

diamondhead wrote: post #90

Question: what happens when a guy copies pinboard (in other words, the old delicious) and open sources it? A community evolves. And some of paid pinboard users switch to the free one because it's open source, some people implement some cool stuff periodically, it'll be maintained forever. Another question: What happens when pinboard makes less money? These questions were answered 30 years ago by OSS community.

Sure, the code will be open source. It will still have to be hosted somewhere. Who'll pay the bills?

Pinboard's long-term income is primarily from the archiving users. The storage and full-text search index would be even more expensive to host for free.

Re: Don't Be A Free User

#93

Post by einhverfr » Wed, Dec 07, 2011, 1:22 AM UTC

There are a bunch of ways of monetizing free use though. I work with Free/Open Source accounting/ERP software and I estimate that less than 1% of our users put money back in our pockets.... But at the same time a lot put money in somebody's pockets, and this grows the community which makes us all more successful and prosperous.

Re: Don't Be A Free User

#94

Post by gcr » Wed, Dec 07, 2011, 1:35 AM UTC

At risk of squabbling over semantics, "Free software", as used in the article, is orthoganal to open-source software. If the source code for these websites were released, even at the end, there would be no issue. Case in point: Etherpad released their source code just before taking their wave dive, starting Piratepad et al.

Re: Don't Be A Free User

#95

Post by diamondhead » Wed, Dec 07, 2011, 1:41 AM UTC

jarek wrote: post #92

diamondhead wrote: post #90

Question: what happens when a guy copies pinboard (in other words, the old delicious) and open sources it? A community evolves. And some of paid pinboard users switch to the free one because it's open source, some people implement some cool stuff periodically, it'll be maintained forever. Another question: What happens when pinboard makes less money? These questions were answered 30 years ago by OSS community.

Sure, the code will be open source. It will still have to be hosted somewhere. Who'll pay the bills? Pinboard's long-term income is primarily from the archiving users. The storage and full-text search index would be even more expensive to host for free.

I search my bookmarks with grep thanks to a local, plain text copy of them. It's so fast and can be programmed in a way that I can search I bookmarks before I open my browser.

There are way better architectures to have an unsocial bookmarking service. Pinboard has the worst one and because its focus is to copy Delicious and make money. In other words, it creates the problem first, and gives users an expensive solution.

An open source solution that can kill Pinboard may be based on even DropBox. OSS community is good at solving real problems.

Re: Don't Be A Free User

#96

Post by nhangen » Wed, Dec 07, 2011, 1:42 AM UTC

Finding out that Trunk.ly, which I've grown to love, is shutting down...well it flat out pisses me off.

Great post. Thanks for having the courage to state the truth, that most startup founders don't give a about users.

Re: Don't Be A Free User

#97

Post by bodegajed » Wed, Dec 07, 2011, 1:42 AM UTC

DanielBMarkham wrote: post #58

This article brings up a good point: if you just found some super-cool free web application that you love? Odds are the only thing you're doing when you use it and recommend it to your friends is creating a nice resume for some large company to do a "talent acquisition" Large companies love this -- they find a couple of guys who are able to identify and engage audiences and then they kill their product and stick them…

Well said and I completely agree. The tricky part here is that the large companies who do it announce it as "bought" or "acquired" whereas they just hire the team and kill the product. Good example recently was the Techcrunch headline "Facebook Has Acquired Gowalla"

Which really doesn't sound right. Entrepreneurship is all about being profitable and getting customers and not to get acquired.

Re: Don't Be A Free User

#98

Post by joelhooks » Wed, Dec 07, 2011, 1:48 AM UTC

drhayes9 wrote: post #70

DanielBMarkham wrote: post #58

This article brings up a good point: if you just found some super-cool free web application that you love? Odds are the only thing you're doing when you use it and recommend it to your friends is creating a nice resume for some large company to do a "talent acquisition" Large companies love this -- they find a couple of guys who are able to identify and engage audiences and then they kill their product and stick them…

Amy Hoy is a big proponent of bootstrapping. Her 30x500 class seems to rock (according to the sample materials she has out there), and she has some choice words on the subject: http://unicornfree.com/2011/fuck-glory-startups-are-one-long...

I'm currently enjoying the 30x500 class. It certainly isn't free, but it is excellent.

Re: Don't Be A Free User

#99

Post by jsilence » Wed, Dec 07, 2011, 1:50 AM UTC

jsilence wrote: post #65

Put a Flattr button on your free cool website. ( https://flattr.com/ ) Problem solved.

Ok, maybe I should have worded it: Another alternative in between paysite and freesite would be to give the user the opportunity to pay whatever they want. With Flattr or Kachingle.

Re: Don't Be A Free User

#100

Post by jarek » Wed, Dec 07, 2011, 1:52 AM UTC

diamondhead wrote: post #95

jarek wrote: post #92

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sure, the code will be open source. It will still have to be hosted somewhere. Who'll pay the bills? Pinboard's long-term income is primarily from the archiving users. The storage and full-text search index would be even more expensive to host for free.

I search my bookmarks with grep thanks to a local, plain text copy of them. It's so fast and can be programmed in a way that I can search I bookmarks before I open my browser. There are way better architectures to have an unsocial bookmarking service. Pinboard has the worst one and because its focus is to copy Delicious and make money. In other words, it creates the problem first, and gives users an expensive solutio…

Sounds like Pinboard isn't the solution for you. However, it evidently appeals to many, myself included.

I don't think I ever have my browser not open. I use something like four different computers, not including mobile devices, and appreciate the central copy without having to think about syncing it. I don't worry about setting up scripts on my local machine or updating my local plain text copy so that it can be searched. For the archiving users, they don't have to manually save the files of each website they'd like to search later.

If you believe you can do bookmarking better and free, then do it. If it matches what I'm using Pinboard for, and is better (and doesn't use Dropbox), I'll switch.