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Why I Don't Use Netscape (1999)

complang.tuwien.ac.at

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Re: Why I Don't Use Netscape (1999)

#271

Post by jussij »

queuebert wrote: post #157
jussij wrote: post #154

For anyone who was actually around at that time you need to remember Windows was Windows 95 and that meant a badly behaved application generally required a reboot. From what I remember of that time, Windows Explorer seemed a little faster, but most importantly it also seemed to require fewer reboots.

That's not my memory of it. Windows 95 introduced the Task Manager, which obviated some of that. Maybe I was lucky in having well-behaved applications.

I was recalling my time writing Windows applications using C and Win16/Win32. That combination made it easy to write a badly behaved application; a stray C pointer here, an uninitialized handle there and before you know it, you've created a badly behaved Windows application. That then could easily result in a Windows to crash or lockup which then would require a reboot. Developing on a modern OS is so much easier only because the OS can protect itself from these badly written applications.

Re: Why I Don't Use Netscape (1999)

#272

Post by glroyal »

badsectoracula wrote: post #13

Considering all the discussions about JavaScript and sites with primarily text requiring it, this looks like the more things change, the more they remain the same :-P. Also see Wirth's Plea for Lean Software[0] from 1995 for another "timeless" issue. I did find this bit interesting too... > Apart from this practical reason, there's a principal one: The first time I invoked Netscape, it said that it is obsolete and re…

In find it interesting that Wirth would accept needless complexity as jihad, and then put an object oriented programming language at the heart of his "back to basics" workstation Oberon.

Sweeping complexity under the rug isn't the same thing as removing it.

Re: Why I Don't Use Netscape (1999)

#273

Post by Merciernmon »

forgotmypw17 wrote: post #266
Merciernmon wrote: post #211

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You're in luck: Apple Maps does offer transit directions. You can also toggle on viewing transit lines in the map mode menu.

Not the DuckDuckGo version, from what I can see.

Ah, you're right. I use the app versions on MacOS and iOS, which I what I was thinking about.

Re: Why I Don't Use Netscape (1999)

#274

Post by forgotmypw17 »

Beldin wrote: post #143
imiric wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Security isn't everything, there's also accessibility to think about. TLS is not just about security. It also protects the authenticity of your content, ensures privacy and even accessibility for your visitors. Without it, any node between your visitor and your server could inject content and JavaScript to do all sorts of nefarious tracking and profiling. These days there's really no excuse for using plain HTTP on…

It's not just your site: an HTTP site allows for injecting HTTP urls for images/css files on other sites, e.g. If target.site's auth or session cookies aren't properly protected, this is sufficient for stealing them [1]. And plenty of sites have insufficient protection on their cookies [1]. [1] http://www.open.ou.nl/hjo/papers/compsec21.pdf

Thanks for the paper link.

There are risks and there are benefits. Managing the risks to get the benefits is the game.

My sites only use cookies for user preferences preferences and client-linked session tokens, so I am not too worried.

A different way to mitigate the risks is by only storing information that does not need to be private, remaining small and un-interesting, designing for transparency and auditability, and keeping a close eye on those audit logs.

Re: Why I Don't Use Netscape (1999)

#275

Post by forgotmypw17 »

neurostimulant wrote: post #125
forgotmypw17 wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Actually, there is a very good excuse: I want to access the content I need with the browser and configuration I currently have, and without the ability to alter it. While the threat of MITM is technically true, thanks to being on a relatively safe networks segment, I have yet to encounter it happening in the real world, except in cases of captive portals, when I actually want it to happen. I think it is largely an ov…

You must be lucky. My cellphone carrier used to injects scripts and ads on plain http requests. Imagine seeing ads on wikipedia. Now that https is everywhere, this behavior is largely stop.

I know that ads sometimes get injected for some people, but it has not been an issue for me.

I see loud and intrusive ads on Wikipedia already, and it's why I've started using wikiless instead.

Re: Why I Don't Use Netscape (1999)

#276

Post by forgotmypw17 »

danjoredd wrote: post #144
exitb wrote: post #74

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Are there any version of Mosaic that are able to handle modern HTTPS?

Honestly thinking on making a Mosaic clone. Without CSS or Javascript, I imagine it won't be terribly difficult to put together

I think it's a great idea! Go for it!

Web 2.5 is a thing.

Re: Why I Don't Use Netscape (1999)

#277

Post by forgotmypw17 »

layer8 wrote: post #178
forgotmypw17 wrote: post #70

I still use this strategy, though these days, I primarily use Mosaic and Netscape for testing. I tend to browse without JavaScript enabled, except for places I already trust to not abuse it. And if there is anything blocking me from accessing the page, such as a modal dialog, a cookie notice, a survey, a prompt to sign up for the newsletter, I close the tab. Over time, I have found that type of rude lack of considera…

> I like the term "featurism", I'm going to try to remember it. They actually could have translated it 1:1 as “featuritis”. It basically means the same as “feature creep”.

I think they're two different, related words. Featuritis, the condition of software having too many features, is caused by featurism, the underconstrained and overemphasized pursuit of features.

Re: Why I Don't Use Netscape (1999)

#278

Post by neurostimulant »

forgotmypw17 wrote: post #275
neurostimulant wrote: post #125

Earlier quoted context omitted.

You must be lucky. My cellphone carrier used to injects scripts and ads on plain http requests. Imagine seeing ads on wikipedia. Now that https is everywhere, this behavior is largely stop.

I know that ads sometimes get injected for some people, but it has not been an issue for me. I see loud and intrusive ads on Wikipedia already, and it's why I've started using wikiless instead.

Are you sure about seeing ads Wikipedia? AFAIK Wikipedia itself doesn't run any ads [1] (except occasional call for donation), so the ads must've come from other source (e.g malicious extensions, malwares that install mitm proxy to inject ads, etc).

[1] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wikipedia:Funding_Wikipedia_th...

Re: Why I Don't Use Netscape (1999)

#279

Post by Tagbert »

forgotmypw17 wrote: post #80
tannhaeuser wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firefox on Ubuntu (which I'm not using anymore for these and other reasons) and presumably on other OSs does exactly that: refuse to open new tabs/sites once every two weeks or so, telling me "one more thing we need to do" ie self-update. So you're loosing all your browsing context, though FF does a better job restoring it after restart than it used to, but still that's user-hostile and self-important as fuck. And th…

Gosh, that is frustrating to even read about. The first time it happened, I would get rid of whatever software was involved in causing it and never use it again, except for testing purposes. I completely agree with you about everything else too. The Web is mature enough that I can use a well-tested website with a 20-year-old browser. There is no technical reason to not have a minimum-viable web browser with a smaller…

As someone else pointed out above. This is not due to Firefox per se but due to the OS changing dependent packages. I understand if you install Firefox directly from their website rather than through the system package installed you won’t have that behavior. It does not happen on other OSs.

Re: Why I Don't Use Netscape (1999)

#280

Post by Tagbert »

mellavora wrote: post #99
tannhaeuser wrote: post #19

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Firefox on Ubuntu (which I'm not using anymore for these and other reasons) and presumably on other OSs does exactly that: refuse to open new tabs/sites once every two weeks or so, telling me "one more thing we need to do" ie self-update. So you're loosing all your browsing context, though FF does a better job restoring it after restart than it used to, but still that's user-hostile and self-important as fuck. And th…

Firefox on Mac. I have this problem as well, even with "autoupdate" set to true. Also, if I am browsing in the middle of an auto update, it refuses to open new tabs. And each update logs me out of my password manager Worse, now this is happening to Thunderbird. Wasn't an issue until about a month ago. Now I need to re-install Thunderbird every few weeks because they've pushed an update. When from my point of view, as…

I use FF on Mac OS and have never seen it refuse to operate due to an update. It will sometimes popup a dialog letting me know there is an update but I can dismiss it. I tend to check for updates every couple of weeks, anyway. The update process is mostly painless though it does restart the browser. That is probably a good thing anyway. Most updates I get when I do update the browser for other reasons and it installs and update as it is restarting.
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