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How much have tech layoffs affected engineers vs. other departments?

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Re: How much have tech layoffs affected engineers vs. other departments?

#281

Post by nopenopenopeno »

User23 wrote: post #229
no_wizard wrote: post #58

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm seeing a massive uptick in recruiting for contract roles compared to a year ago though. A year ago (and even, 3-4 months ago) it was all full time positions nearly exclusively, now it's all heavily weighted toward contract Lots of "18+ month" or "long term" contract verbiage, but contract none the less. Definitely a shift. Seeing more contract to hire too

I really like contract to hire, both from the employee and the employer perspective. You have a nice honeymoon period and if it works then great and if not no hard feelings.

It sounds like you are either being dishonest or you haven’t actually thought about this.

Re: How much have tech layoffs affected engineers vs. other departments?

#282

Post by jokethrowaway »

dominotw wrote: post #9
sarchertech wrote: post #6

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Staff engineer is just title inflation for what used to be senior engineer. Senior engineers at most companies just means this isn’t your first job right out of college.

I have 15 yoe and have senior software engineer title so do people with 2 yrs experience. I might be doing same thing over and over. Time to make a radical change :/.

3 jobs ago I was principal engineer, 2 jobs ago I was an engineer, now I'm a senior.

The type of work I'm doing has been the same, manage a team or more of engineers, do some architecture, some coding, help and mentor other engineers.

Pay went up.

Re: How much have tech layoffs affected engineers vs. other departments?

#283

Post by ShamelessC »

hirvi74 wrote: post #271
wobbly_bush wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There are also plenty of people unhappy with their FAANG jobs and don't want to trade it for a growth-chasing but ultimately unfulfilling startup. Those might be tempted to join a more robust startup.

Really? Why? I thought FAANG jobs were the closest thing to heaven on earth. Okay, I am being obnoxious, but seriously, this is first I have heard of this. Do you know why? Surely it can't be the remote work thing. I would assume there has to more to this.

Have you ever worked for a large company? Some people thrive there, others would rather die.

I assume it's mostly about that.

Re: How much have tech layoffs affected engineers vs. other departments?

#284

Post by ido »

CydeWeys wrote: post #238
no_wizard wrote: post #127

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think it has more to do with getting around benefits, usually. The expense for businesses isn't just the salary, in fact alot of businesses, if they could just pay the salary, would be able to retain / hire more people, but benefits + high salary is harder to take on. This is a great argument for universal healthcare and a nationalized pension system, but I digress

Tech workers are so highly compensated anyway that benefits aren't a huge percentage of the total cost of employment. The main reasons to prefer contractors in times of economic difficulty are: (a) contracts are fixed length, so it's easy to simply let a contract lapse rather than renewing it if conditions worsen/don't improve and you want to cut headcount without having a layoff, and (b) contractors frequently count…

I don’t know the situation in the US but in Germany a large part of basic benefits (your company might offer more on top) are explicitly a % if your salary, to the point where you can say the minimum legally required benefits (and often the minimum is what you get) mean salary cost regardless of how much you earn is about 23% higher than gross salary. When I worked remotely for a US firm they paid me 25% more on the advertised gross salary to compensate for not being able to offer benefits abroad (I was a freelancer as they didn’t have a German subsidiary), which sounds like not that different than the German overhead.

Re: How much have tech layoffs affected engineers vs. other departments?

#285

Post by JamesianP »

roflyear wrote: post #181
01100011 wrote: post #104

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I believe it's typical before a recession though :D

Right. But the claim is were in a recession now not that we're right before one..

but then the context is a discussion about recent layoffs

Re: How much have tech layoffs affected engineers vs. other departments?

#286

Post by csomar »

remexre wrote: post #268
csomar wrote: post #263

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I actually see this as a good thing. The market got flooded with bootcamp dudes. I've nothing against people who are self-taught or changed careers (I am one). But many of the "developers" joining the market are really only interested in making a quick buck with as little effort as possible. (and adding a whole new range of buzzwords too). The Tech industry is not going anywhere, though. We are still in a paradigm sh…

Dental?

Invisalign.

Re: How much have tech layoffs affected engineers vs. other departments?

#287

Post by jamesfinlayson »

Hermitian909 wrote: post #193
adam_arthur wrote: post #173

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course it's decreasing. The amount of people required to maintain an application of a given size continues to drop significantly over time. Something like Docusign, once built out, could be maintained by a handful of people using serverless components. Same thing with Twitter and pretty much every other application.

Interestingly, as a side effect of this, the marginal gains on the most skilled engineers continues to increase. For certain classes of work it is very difficult to hire even at the top of the market. There are positions my company would happily pay a million/yr to fill and simply cannot find anyone who meets the requirements.

What sort of positions out of curiosity?

Re: How much have tech layoffs affected engineers vs. other departments?

#288

Post by throwawaylinux »

RC_ITR wrote: post #267
throwawaylinux wrote: post #266

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's not convoluted at all, it makes perfect sense and you explain it well.

Philosophically, GDP is an useful economic metric because it proxies economic activity and in theirframework, economic activity is up, we are just paying for it via trade imbalance, which great, I love that foreigners will trade us goods for debt/assets. Hard to call that a recession (which again is why the 2 quarters thing is dumb).

You just can't give it a rest can you? You're in total denial of the reality that many people including experts and journalists use the GDP 2 quarters definition, entirely because you are blinded by politics. You didn't even understand how GDP was calculated and had to have the parent poster kindly and simply explain it to you, and instead of being grateful and learning something you've sunk to "it's dumb lol".

Re: How much have tech layoffs affected engineers vs. other departments?

#289

Post by sodafountan »

b20000 wrote: post #251
sodafountan wrote: post #231

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I haven't seen this at all, I'm currently contracting and I see rates anywhere from 63.50 per hour to 80+. Depending on the locale and whether we're talking FAANG or not those are pretty good rates. (130-150+ respectively)

$150 per hour is very low.

That's 130,000-150,000 annually if you clock 40 hours 5 days a week, not hourly.

I don't know in what universe you think $150 per hour is low, I've never seen anything near that rate. Maybe for highly specialized work but not any general purpose development.

Re: How much have tech layoffs affected engineers vs. other departments?

#290

Post by dnissley »

wobbly_bush wrote: post #171
adam_arthur wrote: post #96

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It will definitely do that if FAANG comp compresses via lower equity issuances. The difference is startups generally can’t compensate at the level that FAANGs do or did. And if discount rate stays higher, valuations will be much lower at the same revenue and growth rates than they had been in the past. Of course this also implies the value of the dollars you earn is greater via opportunity of higher yielding investme…

There are also plenty of people unhappy with their FAANG jobs and don't want to trade it for a growth-chasing but ultimately unfulfilling startup. Those might be tempted to join a more robust startup.

Those people already left or are on their way out soon, and there is a fresh crop every year
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