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Removing SMS support from Signal Android (soon)

signal.org

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Re: Removing SMS support from Signal Android (soon)

#161

Post by fluidcruft »

_jsnk wrote: post #34

I'm very upset by this decision. I've been using Signal as my SMS app for a very long time. Messages that I would have sent via SMS currently will automatically get sent via Signal if the person I'm sending to has started using Signal without my knowledge. This has happened in several instances where I was pleasantly surprised to see a friend had started using Signal. Now that I'm forced into a separate SMS app, this…

Exactly. Dumbest idea ever. Apparently Signal thinks they can recruit all of us as their sales force.

Re: Removing SMS support from Signal Android (soon)

#162

Post by causi »

eatwater123 wrote: post #10

This is an awful decision. I've converted some friends and family to Signal over the past years (it took a while) and it is now their default messaging app on their phones. This is going to confuse them and is going to make it difficult for me to keep convincing them that Signal is the route to use. ("Why do I need 3 apps (Android Messages, Signal, Whatsapp) to talk to people?")

This is an awful decision. I've converted some friends and family to Signal over the past years (it took a while) and it is now their default messaging app on their phones. This is going to confuse them and is going to make it difficult for me to keep convincing them that Signal is the route to use.

I learned to stop trying to improve the technical lives of other people after Dropbox's decision to restrict free accounts to three devices resulted in a shitstorm of angry and confused messages from half the people I know.

Re: Removing SMS support from Signal Android (soon)

#163

Post by kelvie »

KerryJones wrote: post #24

... and there's the reason I will likely stop using Signal? Signal was always one of those "win-win" apps, get more security when it's available and I don't have to worry about adding to the giant bucket of messaging apps. They were a paragon of putting the user first and I was a strong supporter... but now... Why not Telegram? Or anything else? I don't need the security, it was nice-to-have. Having to switch between…

"why not anything else" is mostly (for me) because they are a non-profit, and unlikely to be bought by or turn into a megacorp, similar to how wikipedia runs, although they're certainly a mega-something at this point, it still feels a lot less evil than a facebook or a google.

Re: Removing SMS support from Signal Android (soon)

#164

Post by Xelynega »

tomcam wrote: post #86
mitchellpkt wrote: post #70

This seems to be a "bug or feature" situation where the answer depends on the user profile. The ability for messages to leave the Signal app in plaintext SMS is a "feature" for users whose top needs include a single-app UX, and a "bug" for users whose top needs include an app that is foolproof E2EE (so users don't have to consciously pay attention to which conversations are Signal-native vs SMS). Maybe SMS support co…

None of the naysayers has addressed your point (and those of TFA) rationally, as you have.

UX elements already exist to tell the user whether they're encrypted or not, removing the ability to send unencrypted shrinks their userbase while ensuring the apps adoption plummets.

There, points addressed. Can we move on?

Re: Removing SMS support from Signal Android (soon)

#165

Post by dodgerdan »

arise wrote: post #92
dodgerdan wrote: post #66

SMS and security are simply incompatible. And either you fall into one of two groups 1. You know sms is insecure and this is a insecure method of communication 2. You think sms sent via signal is secure because it’s a “secure messenger”. It’s clear that HN users will fall into group 1, but the vast majority of people would fall into group 2. So for me this is an overall security win.

Signal has clear UI cues and redundant messaging telling you what actions are insecure.

Google did a security research around ssl and a crazy percentage of people think the lock icon is actually a handbag icon. The rest of the research highlighted how most users aren’t able to make informed choices, most people lack the technical basis to make those choices.

Re: Removing SMS support from Signal Android (soon)

#166

Post by giskou »

_jsnk wrote: post #34

I'm very upset by this decision. I've been using Signal as my SMS app for a very long time. Messages that I would have sent via SMS currently will automatically get sent via Signal if the person I'm sending to has started using Signal without my knowledge. This has happened in several instances where I was pleasantly surprised to see a friend had started using Signal. Now that I'm forced into a separate SMS app, this…

I have been receiving notifications that a person in my contact list is now using Signal for years.

Apart from that, your use case has another possible issue. If a person stops using Signal, your messages will go to the void until Signal actually removes the user and your client switches back to SMS. This has caused a lot of confusion for some of my friends when I switched my signal account to a different phone number.

I think it's more reliable to use Signal for Signal.

Re: Removing SMS support from Signal Android (soon)

#167

Post by soulofmischief »

> We have now reached the point where SMS support no longer makes sense.

What a laughable, out of touch suggestion. Did anyone at Signal actually ask the community what they thought about removing SMS support?

Seriously, this decision is going to kill Signal app. It will halt the majority of growth as evangelists such as myself can no longer recommend it with a straight face. Signal is supposed to enhance the messaging experience, not replace it.

I think Signal thinks they can take on the WhatsApp market, completely misunderstanding why that market didn't choose Signal in the first place. The products serve two completely different user needs, and are highly geographically segregated.

What the heck is going on over at Signal Foundation?

Re: Removing SMS support from Signal Android (soon)

#168

Post by mynameisvlad »

tadfisher wrote: post #154
mynameisvlad wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

They say “opportunistic” as in similar to how iMessage works. If you’re both on the platform, it’s encrypted but you still can communicate with everyone else from one app. That’s a major boost for those that might not particularly care about encryption to look for specific messaging apps, while still helping by building out the network slowly over time.

The downside is that they will opportunistically send your messages via Signal. If the recipient chooses to not have SIgnal installed any longer, then your messages go into a black hole. This became much more of a problem for me after they rolled out their shitcoin; suddenly my techie friends were just not responding to messages, and Signal as my main SMS app was not falling back to SMS for these folks.

Apple has the same problem, and an article and entire process for disabling it out of band, plus a heartbeat so it’s done automatically after a while if you don’t reset your phone. It’s a major problem.

I’ve only done the switch from iOS to Android once and I remember it was a pain for a few days until everything realized I didn’t have iMessage anymore.

Re: Removing SMS support from Signal Android (soon)

#169

Post by andwaal »

If anyone want a privacy focused all in one app I cannot recommend Beeper enough. I have been using it as my main app for SMS, messenger, WhatsApp and LinkedIn for half a year now and have only positiv experiences. Some bugs still, but amazing support and continuous fixes.

https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=25848278

Re: Removing SMS support from Signal Android (soon)

#170

Post by lucideer »

dodgerdan wrote: post #66

SMS and security are simply incompatible. And either you fall into one of two groups 1. You know sms is insecure and this is a insecure method of communication 2. You think sms sent via signal is secure because it’s a “secure messenger”. It’s clear that HN users will fall into group 1, but the vast majority of people would fall into group 2. So for me this is an overall security win.

Most of those in group 2 are not using Signal.

Beyond that, the minority in group 2 that use Signal are most likely to be using default settings. SMS handling is a non-default option. So you're left with a very tiny minority.

Group 1 makes up the vast vast majority of the userbase (and most likely 100% of the evangelising userbase)

(Also: if things are unclear for non-technical users, that's a UX challenge, not an absolute)

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