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Geothermal may beat batteries for energy storage

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Re: Geothermal may beat batteries for energy storage

#3
It's laughable this was published citing: "the storage capacity effectively comes free of charge" when the whole mess we're in is the tragedy of the commons.

FWIW, the link to the Google article is much more interesting: https://cloud.google.com/blog/products/infrastructure/google...

Re: Geothermal may beat batteries for energy storage

#4

One wonders what the limits of "Thermal Heat" are from small "wells"(???) up to the heat content of the Earth's ore (Heat relative to sea level) How much heat is generated by Earth's gravity onto itself? How "renewable" is Geothermal energy, truly?

About 47 terawatts

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth%27s_energy_budget#Earth'...

Re: Geothermal may beat batteries for energy storage

#5

One wonders what the limits of "Thermal Heat" are from small "wells"(???) up to the heat content of the Earth's ore (Heat relative to sea level) How much heat is generated by Earth's gravity onto itself? How "renewable" is Geothermal energy, truly?

From the Wikipedia article on "Geothermal energy":

"Geothermal power is considered to be renewable because any projected heat extraction is small compared to the Earth's heat content. The Earth has an internal heat content of 10^31 joules (3·10^15 TWh), approximately 100 billion times the 2010 worldwide annual energy consumption.[...] About 20% of this is residual heat from planetary accretion; the remainder is attributed to past and current radioactive decay of naturally occurring isotopes." -- https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Geothermal_energy#Renewability...

Re: Geothermal may beat batteries for energy storage

#6

One wonders what the limits of "Thermal Heat" are from small "wells"(???) up to the heat content of the Earth's ore (Heat relative to sea level) How much heat is generated by Earth's gravity onto itself? How "renewable" is Geothermal energy, truly?

Majority of geothermal enery comes from the decay of radioactive isotopes. It's not renewable, but there will be enough heat for millions of years.

Re: Geothermal may beat batteries for energy storage

#7
Interesting option. It's all about the cost and efficiencies in the end.

Converting electricity into heat and then back into electricity is a lossy process that is constrained by the second law of thermodynamics. Basically generating heat is easy and efficient. But converting it back to electricity is typically less than 50% efficient. Basically, it's several energy conversions in one process: you use electricity to produce heat, heat to produce mechanical energy, and then mechanical energy to produce electricity. All of those steps are lossy, some more than others. And it multiplies. It adds up to less than 50% efficiency, at best.

Lithium ion batteries are much better at over 90% efficiency. But they are relatively expensive for large amounts of storage. So they don't scale. But they have no moving parts and you can scale the capacity at which they absorb and release energy pretty much linearly. Which is why they are popular for balancing the grid.

Pumped hydro, which is a type of battery that has a relatively large amount of deployed capacity in some countries (many gwh of power stored) is both efficient and cost effective. But it's highly dependent on terrain. Yet parts of Canada run almost exclusively on hydro and pumped hydro.

Re: Geothermal may beat batteries for energy storage

#8

Interesting option. It's all about the cost and efficiencies in the end. Converting electricity into heat and then back into electricity is a lossy process that is constrained by the second law of thermodynamics. Basically generating heat is easy and efficient. But converting it back to electricity is typically less than 50% efficient. Basically, it's several energy conversions in one process: you use electricity to…

I wonder if it would be possible to scale down pumped hydro to something the size of a tall water tower. Probably not worth it due to the small height difference and volume, and you'd also lose efficiency due to the smaller turbine, but I still do wonder what the actual figures are like for something like that. Especially in cost per kWh stored compared to lithium.

Re: Geothermal may beat batteries for energy storage

#9
It is not clear to me how they use the solar and wind power.

Are they heating the steam from a geothermal source, higher than the source's temperature, and sending it back down the geothermal well when power is cheap? And then later run the steam through a turbine when power is expensive?

Or are they using cheap power to pump water into the well at high pressure, to force it it deeper into the fractured rock? And then later use the extra steam to produce power?

Or something else?

Re: Geothermal may beat batteries for energy storage

#10
post #4

One wonders what the limits of "Thermal Heat" are from small "wells"(???) up to the heat content of the Earth's ore (Heat relative to sea level) How much heat is generated by Earth's gravity onto itself? How "renewable" is Geothermal energy, truly?

About 47 terawatts https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Earth%27s_energy_budget#Earth'...

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