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Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

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Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#251

Post by monksy »

jen20 wrote: post #227
sccxy wrote: post #205

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Have you flown with LH recently? If something happens then they shut down service desk and don't help you at all. Find your own solution and then they ignore you if you want hotel/travel costs paid back. I'm still waiting ~4000 eur from them. But only one human reply that they forwarded claim to another department. 3 months and counting... And I resend all my claims weekly and hope for the best. Phone support is even…

Yes, I flew with them on Thursday, and the Saturday before that. Their hard product in Europe is second only to Turkish Airlines and Virgin Atlantic, neither of which go many places without very inconvenient routing at best. I typically fly LH economy, though have had a few upgrades (meaningless in Europe) over the years. Their business class is not as good as Singapore or Virgin, or modern United, but better than BA…

lol .. which hard product? I've been on LH flights where the cleaniness is competing with Air india.

Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#252

Post by waste_monk »

LeoPanthera wrote: post #29
kube-system wrote: post #26

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Car keys usually remained powered off until a button is pressed.

Do they though? Lots of cars unlock when you get near to them with the key, which I imagine is technology effectively identical to an AirTag.

I believe they're in a constant low-power mode, I think (?) the car periodically transmits a beacon that "wakes up" the key (assuming it's nearby, of course) and initiates the challenge/response process.

Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#253

Post by bearmode »

cryptonector wrote: post #194
xd wrote: post #62

OT, kinda. My eldest kid is in the final year of UK junior school so finally cut lose to walk to and from school as is culturally acceptable here.. I gave her a phone so she could let us (mum/dad) know she was on her way home from school, deciding to go home to a friends etc.. the school caught wind and apparently it was against school policy so she was disciplined (along with a number of her peers) - the extent of w…

So take the air tag off, or put it in a faraday bag.

He meant the school suggested putting an air tag on the kid rather than giving them a phone. The school isn't tracking the kid.

Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#254

Post by Sporktacular »

fphhotchips wrote: post #151
Sporktacular wrote: post #77

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The article never mentions batteries but says specifically it's because of transmissions. If it was for the batteries that would be no reason to take special issue with trackers but ignore portable weighing scales for example. "Phones don't have to be shut off during flights. That hasn't been a thing for years." During take off and landing they do. Whether of not that's rational or justified is irrelevant. The reason…

> During take off and landing they do No, they don't. You're all over this thread talking about rules that haven't been universal for literally over a decade. Phones haven't had to be turned off for takeoff and landing for over a decade in some places. Radio transmissions haven't had to be disabled (only mobile network transmissions) for years in the USA, Australia and Europe. The Plane Wifi gets turned on when the f…

AirTags don't use Bluetooth! UWB uses a different, relatively untested range of frequencies. The article specifically mentions this is about transmitters. Batteries aren't mentioned as the issue. How many ways does this need to be repeated?

Also, rules for phones are beside the point but I flew on Lufthansa last week. They announced that everyone should switch off phones during the take off and landing. Since Lufthansa is the airline in question, this confirms that they still maintain caution about the issue.

Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#255

Post by zahllos »

Sporktacular wrote: post #127
zahllos wrote: post #118

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I suspect the difference is more about the spectrum in use. Airtags can be found and interact via Ultra-Wideband (UWB), which essentially means low power broadcast across 3.1GHz up to 10GHz approx. This includes some spectrum used for GNSS. One is probably fine but a hold full of them and people's iPhones emitting on UWB also? By contrast Bluetooth, WiFi etc use the ISM radio bands, which can simply be avoided by any…

UWB, which is pretty new, would be a really good explaination of why they single out these trackers specifically. Without some solid test results to clear them, it's understandable why airlines might be nervous. Would just add that it's more what the aircraft needs to reliably receive (not transmit) that is susceptible to local sources of spurious RF.

Yeah agree, receive is probably what I should have said :) I did try to see if there were any discussions of UWB before posting, but only found some PDFs from the FAA from 2015 or so in my casual search. I guess industry insiders might know more. It could well be that the low power was deemed not risky enough (you would have thought all airlines would have banned them if risky) and other posts suggest that in fact Lufthansa have not banned airtags at all... so who knows.

Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#256

Post by Maursault »

huimang wrote: post #206
Maursault wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lexicographers are neither linguists nor philologists, and any among the latter two worth their salt will tell you that "irregardless" is an erroneous and contradictory word, and further point out that whomever the neologist was that originally coined it made the mistake of double negative, such that "irregardless" must mean "with regard" as opposed to "regardless," and, as such, is superfluous.

If enough people use a word, it’s a word. Many words were formed as mistakes, “apron” and “tornado” for example. Dictionaries follow how people are actually speaking, not the other way around.

> If enough people use a word, it’s a word.

Whether or not it is a word is not at issue. Any group of letters forms a word. "Hsyxff" is a word I just made up. The point is "irregardless" is an incorrect word, and no matter how many say wrong is right, it can never change the fact that wrong is still wrong.

> Many words were formed as mistakes, “apron” and “tornado” for example.

These words are not self-contradictory, nor were they formed "as mistakes."

> Dictionaries follow how people are actually speaking, not the other way around.

Dictionaries do not specify which words are spoken, they merely list words in alphabetical order along with their definitions. Dictionaries contain many words that are no longer spoken, such as overmorrow, lunting and groak, counter-examples that prove your assertion wrong.

Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#257

Post by Maursault »

School-Cotton wrote: post #222
Maursault wrote: post #197

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lexicographers are neither linguists nor philologists, and any among the latter two worth their salt will tell you that "irregardless" is an erroneous and contradictory word, and further point out that whomever the neologist was that originally coined it made the mistake of double negative, such that "irregardless" must mean "with regard" as opposed to "regardless," and, as such, is superfluous.

You are simply wrong, at least about linguists.

You are wrong on both accounts.

Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#258

Post by huimang »

Maursault wrote: post #256
huimang wrote: post #206

Earlier quoted context omitted.

If enough people use a word, it’s a word. Many words were formed as mistakes, “apron” and “tornado” for example. Dictionaries follow how people are actually speaking, not the other way around.

> If enough people use a word, it’s a word. Whether or not it is a word is not at issue. Any group of letters forms a word. "Hsyxff" is a word I just made up. The point is "irregardless" is an incorrect word, and no matter how many say wrong is right, it can never change the fact that wrong is still wrong. > Many words were formed as mistakes, “apron” and “tornado” for example. These words are not self-contradictory,…

In order for something to be recognized as a word, it needs to have meaning and be understood by more than 1 person. For brevity's sake, when I said "it's a word", I really meant "it's a word that's used and recognized by a large subset of people, large enough that lexicographers at dictionaries have taken notice".

"Irregardless" is not incorrect if enough people start using it that way. That's simply how languages work. You can have an opinion on specific words, but you cannot -assert- that using them is "incorrect". It's your opinion, not fact. Everyone also understands people when they use irregardless.

"These words are not self-contradictory, nor were they formed "as mistakes.""

Apron was originally "napron". It formed this spelling from people misunderstanding "a napron" as "an apron". Tornado should be tronado, because it comes from spanish tronada. Regardless (or irregardless? :)), the English language has many, many such words. My point is English already has so many words that are "mistakes", so arguing about "irregardless" doesn't make sense. No language used by humans is without illogical things.

"[Dictionaries] merely list words in alphabetical order along with their definitions"

Yes. They have criteria for when a -new- word becomes used enough that it enters the public lexicon, or an existing word gains a new usage. Like "literally" and "irregardless". You can't say it's wrong anymore when enough people are using it that way.

Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#259

Post by jen20 »

monksy wrote: post #251
jen20 wrote: post #227

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yes, I flew with them on Thursday, and the Saturday before that. Their hard product in Europe is second only to Turkish Airlines and Virgin Atlantic, neither of which go many places without very inconvenient routing at best. I typically fly LH economy, though have had a few upgrades (meaningless in Europe) over the years. Their business class is not as good as Singapore or Virgin, or modern United, but better than BA…

lol .. which hard product? I've been on LH flights where the cleaniness is competing with Air india.

I'm sure. Your anecdata is as good as mine. Skytrax disagree with you though.

Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#260

Post by cryptonector »

bearmode wrote: post #253
cryptonector wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So take the air tag off, or put it in a faraday bag.

He meant the school suggested putting an air tag on the kid rather than giving them a phone. The school isn't tracking the kid.

Oh, well, that's different.
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