Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children' • Hacker News Board

Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#211

Post by secondcoming » Sun, Oct 09, 2022, 2:36 PM UTC

philliphaydon wrote: post #98

notart666 wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many of them just can't speak English correctly. Only a small percentage of the individuals who speak English at a proficient level of those who do, they predominately come from very wealthy upper caste families and now you have a new problem. And well. When it comes to caste, many Indians simply believe it to not exist anymore in India because of how deeply engrained it is in their social classes they never notice i…

I don’t understand the English thing. I lived in Singapore for 10 years and have heard so many words pronounced wrong. To give an example one of my ex coworkers used to say the word swap as sw-app. Another one said return as ret-urn. I did ask them and they said they are taught phonics and so they just say the words how they are written. English is such a turd language. We have so many rules and then all those rules…

English is a language borne out of centuries of diversity. Its turdness is its strength.

Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#212

Post by dominotw » Sun, Oct 09, 2022, 2:36 PM UTC

mkl95 wrote: post #53

I was a consultant for an American company that also hired dozens of cheap consultants from development countries. Mostly India but also neighbouring countries and some Eastern European countries. Indians were by far the hardest to work with. They ghosted women systematically which was a nightmare for our project manager. They also lied shamelessly about their qualifications which led to absurd situations. The proble…

Main problem with hiring through these shops is you never know who exactly is working on your project. They would present us with resumes of some experienced candidates but it looked like that person is being sold to multiple companies with expectation that he would be exclusive.

They would all be committing to code repo with single "git@congnizant.com" so you never know who the man behind the screen is. All conference calls would have the person we hired on the call but his voice would sound different everytime.

It was freaking nightmare. I will never ever work for a company that does hybrid onshore/offshore development. That evnviroment is a proxy that they treat software dev as mundane cost center that deserves no respect.

Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#213

Post by sk0g » Sun, Oct 09, 2022, 2:36 PM UTC

yalogin wrote: post #15

Infosys is based in India and so naturally they get a lot of candidates of Indian origin. That is just how referrals work. May be they wanted to hire diverse candidates but the huge issue is the ask about not hiring women with children and people over 50. I wonder how common this is in the valley, particularly not hiring people over 50

I've had Infosys and TCS reach out to me, and when pressed for salary figures said the upper end was a half of my current salary, and this is in Australia. I'm not even on a particularly high salary, could have gotten a ~30% pay rise had I joined an industry I wasn't keen on...

Not convinced it isn't some sort of legal obligation thing to bring in cheap labour, or just preying on people who need a quick job to maintain their visa obligations. Offering {minimum_wage + 30%} for a software engineer with a few years of experience seems like an exercise in futility otherwise.

Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#214

Post by NoraCodes » Sun, Oct 09, 2022, 2:36 PM UTC

NeverFade wrote: post #127

nerdponx wrote: post #11

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Emphasizing hiring of groups that have been traditionally discriminated against absolutely has a different moral character from discriminating against those people. There are a variety of ways to argue against the former practice, but to draw equivalence with the latter practice is dishonest and/or willfully ignorant.

I'm sure that will be a great comfort to the Asian kid who was born in poverty, got bullied in school, struggled all his life to achieve the grades and stats to qualify for a top school, then got rejected in favor of a rich black American kid, since he was born with the wrong skin color.

Hmm, this is not a good criticism of affirmative action programs. A child from a rich family, of whatever race, is far more likely to be able to attend the college of their (or their parents') choice, based on a wide array of factors. This is mitigated somewhat by federal and institutional need-based and merit-based aid, but I don't think it's really supportable to say that it's exacerbated by affirmative action. If your concern really is that poor students aren't able to access as many opportunities as wealthy students, you should be some flavor of socialist, as under capitalism, wealth inherently comes with more opportunity.

In clearer words: I think you made this situation up without considering other factors because you have an ideological agenda.

Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#215

Post by LeonB » Sun, Oct 09, 2022, 2:36 PM UTC

azangru wrote: post #126

notart666 wrote: post #73

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many of them just can't speak English correctly. Only a small percentage of the individuals who speak English at a proficient level of those who do, they predominately come from very wealthy upper caste families and now you have a new problem. And well. When it comes to caste, many Indians simply believe it to not exist anymore in India because of how deeply engrained it is in their social classes they never notice i…

> Many of them just can't speak English correctly. Only a small percentage of the individuals who speak English at a proficient level of those who do, they predominately come from very wealthy upper caste families and now you have a new problem. There is something very confusing to me in this paragraph. You put forth as a premise (at least if I am understanding the logic of the paragraph correctly) that fluency in En…

The sentence referred to here:

> All good so far. But then you say that it is a problem, and this is where I am lost.

…Is not referring to a problem that has, at that point in the story, been revealed. It is being evocative in a sort of dog-whistle technique - before jumping into the generalisations that follow.

Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#216

Post by fellellor » Sun, Oct 09, 2022, 2:36 PM UTC

mkl95 wrote: post #53

I was a consultant for an American company that also hired dozens of cheap consultants from development countries. Mostly India but also neighbouring countries and some Eastern European countries. Indians were by far the hardest to work with. They ghosted women systematically which was a nightmare for our project manager. They also lied shamelessly about their qualifications which led to absurd situations. The proble…

In this lawsuit, an American woman alleges that a bunch of high level (probably white) American executives in the American branch of an Indian company were very biased against women and workers of Indian origin. And while expressing their biases through their actions they created a very hostile work environment for this person.

At least read the thing for a minute before going on a tangent?

Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#217

Post by TrueGeek » Sun, Oct 09, 2022, 2:37 PM UTC

mkl95 wrote: post #53

I was a consultant for an American company that also hired dozens of cheap consultants from development countries. Mostly India but also neighbouring countries and some Eastern European countries. Indians were by far the hardest to work with. They ghosted women systematically which was a nightmare for our project manager. They also lied shamelessly about their qualifications which led to absurd situations. The proble…

Some humans suck, some don’t. I don’t think it’s accurate to say this divide is mostly split between countries. I’ve worked with multi-national companies that have great culture and diversity and multi-national companies that are much like you describe. The problem is not that “x people are by far the worst”. The problem is that culture needs to be led top down. It needs to be thought of during hiring. Intolerance needs to be addressed after hiring.

Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#218

Post by secondcoming » Sun, Oct 09, 2022, 2:37 PM UTC

lloydatkinson wrote: post #153

29athrowaway wrote: post #110

Earlier quoted context omitted.

English is an official language over there, but it is spoken differently.

Different indeed. Every sentence sounds like a question with a small delay before the last word of the sentence. I have no idea why this is, but you can see it in literally any Indian engineering lecture recording on YouTube. It definitely does not inspire confidence they know the topic they are teaching.

I find this quirk quite endearing for some reason.

Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#219

Post by sumeno » Sun, Oct 09, 2022, 2:38 PM UTC

jwond wrote: post #156

sumeno wrote: post #111

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Few things make me feel as gross about reading this website than all the whining about discrimination against white men.

Could you explain why? Do you think white men aren’t being discriminated against? Do you think white men are being discriminated against and just don’t like seeing people talk about it? Or maybe some other reason?

Because we work in an industry and are posting on a website that is predominantly male and white. Any time even the smallest measures are taken to improve the balance there's just a bunch of whining about being discriminated against. It's as silly and unfounded as complaining how "foreigners are coming to take our jobs"

It's the same attitude that makes it hard to recruit women and people of color into the industry, they can just look at one of the most well known platforms for discussing the industry and see the rampant sexism and racism

Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#220

Post by wiseowise » Sun, Oct 09, 2022, 2:38 PM UTC

rvba wrote: post #112

mkl95 wrote: post #53

I was a consultant for an American company that also hired dozens of cheap consultants from development countries. Mostly India but also neighbouring countries and some Eastern European countries. Indians were by far the hardest to work with. They ghosted women systematically which was a nightmare for our project manager. They also lied shamelessly about their qualifications which led to absurd situations. The proble…

So the problem is hiring cheap labor, yet you didnt list any problems with Eastern European. Since some Indians fucked something up somewhere, there is subtle racism towards Eastern Europeans?

Eastern Europe candidates are consistently better from my experience.