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Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

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Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> Many of them just can't speak English correctly. Only a small percentage of the individuals who speak English at a proficient level of those who do, they predominately come from very wealthy upper caste families and now you have a new problem. There is something very confusing to me in this paragraph. You put forth as a premise (at least if I am understanding the logic of the paragraph correctly) that fluency in En…

I think he might be implying some issues related to the caste system. It’s been discussed on HN before about how some members of the upper caste may not treat other team members from a lower caste appropriately. Despite no longer being in India, and despite that behavior not being acceptable in the host country.

From personal experience, I've heard plenty of caste-based insults when I was there a decade or so ago, as well as other forms of prejudice. This manifests most explicitly when it comes to marriages I think, but it would be naïve to assume nepotism, and by extension caste-based discrimination, doesn't proliferate to other aspects of life.

Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#172
post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It doesn't, but you can't discriminate against white men. /s

Folks, this is not difficult to understand unless you're deliberately being obtuse. There's legal and illegal discrimination. Some forms of legal discrimination do amount to discrimination against White people. When we say "Discrimination is wrong" we are almost always talking about illegal discrimination. Just crying out that "But.... but you said discrimination is wrong!" really isn't the 'argument' you think it is…

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Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#173
post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many don’t even acknowledge that their policies are discriminatory. But it’s still a good argument to point out that discriminatory diversity policies are discriminatory. Because that forces those that advocate for them to lay out their justifications and also at what point the policy is no longer needed. I’m not against affirmative action where it makes sense, but it’s a heavy handed policy and as such needs very go…

Affirmative action is heavy handed when it involves hard quotas. There's nothing wrong with an affirmative action policy that sets a goal to be more inclusive by reaching out to other groups yet does not require limits strictly on the basis of skin color.

How about just taking the best candidate, and be done with it?

I live in a former socialist state, and a combination of grades and standardized testing is calculated into a score in that score determines if you get accepted to a college or not. Colleges have no idea who you are, until you get an e-mail that you're accepted and come to sign in.

Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#174
post #53

I was a consultant for an American company that also hired dozens of cheap consultants from development countries. Mostly India but also neighbouring countries and some Eastern European countries. Indians were by far the hardest to work with. They ghosted women systematically which was a nightmare for our project manager. They also lied shamelessly about their qualifications which led to absurd situations. The proble…

> They ghosted women systematically which was a nightmare for our project manager.

What do you mean by this? That they refuse to work with women based on their gender?

"India has more women STEM grads than US, UK or France". And I see way way more women employees in software companies in India compared to US.

https://timesofindia.indiatimes.com/india/india-has-more-wom...

Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#175

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t understand the English thing. I lived in Singapore for 10 years and have heard so many words pronounced wrong. To give an example one of my ex coworkers used to say the word swap as sw-app. Another one said return as ret-urn. I did ask them and they said they are taught phonics and so they just say the words how they are written. English is such a turd language. We have so many rules and then all those rules…

English is the simplest Latin based language. This has nothing to do with pronunciation but not even knowing basic words. Or how to communicate. Only a small percentage of Indians speak English and most statistics on it are heavily inflated. The Indian English Education system is the same one the Japanese and Koreans use. And they don't know English. The reality is it's like if you learned Spanish in middle school to…

What do you mean by Latin based language?

Or what are the other "Latin based languages" that you are comparing it to?

Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#176
post #53

I was a consultant for an American company that also hired dozens of cheap consultants from development countries. Mostly India but also neighbouring countries and some Eastern European countries. Indians were by far the hardest to work with. They ghosted women systematically which was a nightmare for our project manager. They also lied shamelessly about their qualifications which led to absurd situations. The proble…

My company quickly realized that outsourcing to an offshore Indian company was a mistake. We tried giving them new projects, but it was useless. We still use them, but only for very simple support work. My project was outsourced to them for support. The transition of our mature project to them took about a year. They wanted to replace our 10-12 person team with about 19 of their people. They also needed some of the people onshore due to regulations. So much for cost savings. And as soon as someone got good, they left the team/company because they could get a better job anywhere else.

My company also outsourced onshore to another Indian company to modernize an area of our business (same area as rhe above example). It's a mess. They're behind schedule by years. They promised they had an ML system to handle this type of business case, but it's not working. They're also telling people to only record 40 hours on their time sheet even if they're working 50-60 hours. They've had so many people leave that they're throwing money at the remaining expert people to stay.

Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#177
post #112
post #53

I was a consultant for an American company that also hired dozens of cheap consultants from development countries. Mostly India but also neighbouring countries and some Eastern European countries. Indians were by far the hardest to work with. They ghosted women systematically which was a nightmare for our project manager. They also lied shamelessly about their qualifications which led to absurd situations. The proble…

So the problem is hiring cheap labor, yet you didnt list any problems with Eastern European. Since some Indians fucked something up somewhere, there is subtle racism towards Eastern Europeans?

No post body was provided.

Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#178

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Many of them just can't speak English correctly. Only a small percentage of the individuals who speak English at a proficient level of those who do, they predominately come from very wealthy upper caste families and now you have a new problem. And well. When it comes to caste, many Indians simply believe it to not exist anymore in India because of how deeply engrained it is in their social classes they never notice i…

> Many of them just can't speak English correctly. Only a small percentage of the individuals who speak English at a proficient level of those who do, they predominately come from very wealthy upper caste families and now you have a new problem. There is something very confusing to me in this paragraph. You put forth as a premise (at least if I am understanding the logic of the paragraph correctly) that fluency in En…

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Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#179
post #99

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> please specify which kind of diversity fosters innovation To keep an open mind I did a thought experiment and found a few: entertainment, fusion food, music, those things I'd imagine benefit greatly from diversity.

You told me human endeavors in which "diversity" (which again, means nothing) fosters innovation. But that wasn't my question. I asked what kind of diversity fosters innovation, not what kind of innovation is fostered by diversity

To err on the side of being as polite as possible: In some grim scenarios, diversity led to certain situations that gave rise to big innovations.

Re: Infosys asked HR not to hire 'Indian-origin candidates', 'women with children'

#180
So, I have only my own limited, American, anecdotal experience, but I did work for Infosys for a little while, so I suppose I should share that here. We were a team of less than a dozen developers, and we had a woman, who as I recall was a mother, as one of our devs.

Not saying this means it didn't happen elsewhere in Infosys.

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