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Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

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Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#181

Post by tsimionescu »

happyopossum wrote: post #119
tsimionescu wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I understand there is nothing new. Lithium batteries have always been allowed in checked luggage only if they are inside a completely powered off and reasonably protected device, to avoid the risk of fires. This risk doesn't really apply to such small batteries, but the rules are there regardless of the size of the battery.

AirTags don’t use lithium ion batteries.

I didn't say lithium ion, I said lithium - they indeed use a different lithium-based chemistry.

Note that lithium itself is a very volatile metal (it starts burning in contact with water, for example).

Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#182

Post by tsimionescu »

ryandrake wrote: post #145
mplewis9z wrote: post #132

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Lithium =/= Lithium-ion

None of this matters. If you search through the article (or the original article that claimed the ban), you will not find the word "lithium". I don't see how this rathole on lithium batteries has anything to do with the article.

People who investigated the claims of the article this one is replying to have found that the original source of this claim was a German article where someone called Lufthansa and asked this question. The answer they got from the Lufthansa representative was essentially citing an ICAO rule about devices with lithium batteries - which got twisted in this "Lufthansa doesn't allow AirTags" narrative.

Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#183

Post by AlfeG »

spoonalious wrote: post #79
Sporktacular wrote: post #66

Earlier quoted context omitted.

1) It's not. They ask people to switch off all transmitters during flights (and later to during takeoff and landing) because of RF emissions. 2) Because you can't turn trackers off, especially when they're in the hold. Read the initial article that started all this, it even says that reason is because of transmissions.

Except they don’t because most have onboard wifi now. And most allow Bluetooth headphones, including Lufthansa: Lufthansa: Bluetooth headphones are allowed during every part of the flight.

All airline I've been travel, disable WiFi during takeoff and landing.

Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#184

Post by tsimionescu »

Sporktacular wrote: post #47
tsimionescu wrote: post #16

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As far as I understand there is nothing new. Lithium batteries have always been allowed in checked luggage only if they are inside a completely powered off and reasonably protected device, to avoid the risk of fires. This risk doesn't really apply to such small batteries, but the rules are there regardless of the size of the battery.

Which is why this isn't about the battery fires. It's about the RF of hundreds of devices.

Here [0] is the FAA site about lithium battery powered devices in checked-in baggage. The ICAO has the same rule, but I haven't found a similarly concise statement.

> Devices containing lithium metal batteries or lithium ion batteries, including – but not limited to – smartphones, tablets, cameras and laptops, should be kept in carry-on baggage. If these devices are packed in checked baggage, they should be turned completely off, protected from accidental activation and packed so they are protected from damage. [emphasis mine]

[0] https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/lithium-batteries-baggage

Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#185

Post by tsimionescu »

pacificmint wrote: post #37
Izikiel43 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the problem with batteries or lithium batteries? AirTags have non lithium batteries

AirTags use CR2032 batteries which are, in fact, lithium batteries. They are lithium primary cells though, not lithium ion cells, which are usually what is banned.

There is no distinction between the two in terms of regulations (all the ones I've seen are explicitly calling both lithium ion and lithium metal batteries).

Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#186

Post by tsimionescu »

fortran77 wrote: post #46
Izikiel43 wrote: post #33

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is the problem with batteries or lithium batteries? AirTags have non lithium batteries

Stop spreading misinformation: >[T]he CR2032 battery is a Lithium-manganese dioxide battery (LiMn02). It is composed of a Mn02 cathode and a lithium anode. The device is specified for a 225 milliamp hours (mAh) and typically operates over a temperature range of –20 ºC to +70 ºC. You will find some alkaline versions available from some vendors, but it's not the norm. Now there may be a chance that Lufthansa didn't mea…

Lithium batteries of any kind have the same regulations in aviation. Here[0] is a link from the US FAA, but you'll find similar at ICAO or any other civil aviation authorities.

[0] https://www.faa.gov/newsroom/lithium-batteries-baggage

Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#187

Post by s3p »

aliqot wrote: post #139
judge2020 wrote: post #106

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Airtags are explicitly not meant to track people. Apple goes out of their way to ensure them and their accessory partners do not advertise them being on a person regardless of age or relation to the airtag owner. But that's the thing with technology, isn't it? New tech comes out, companies do the right thing, but the freedom of the technology itself enables bad actors to abuse or repurpose the technology. For example…

> Airtags are explicitly not meant to track people. Apple goes out of their way to ensure them and their accessory partners do not advertise them being on a person regardless of age or relation to the airtag owner. In this same spirit, gun ads don't have intruders being arbitrated in the ads. Why would Apple display people being tracked? reply

You're comparing the advertisement strategies of a TRACKING device with a weapon capable of killing a human... I do not think it is a good idea to make a false equivalency between the two.

Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#188

Post by tsimionescu »

XorNot wrote: post #141
Sporktacular wrote: post #47

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Which is why this isn't about the battery fires. It's about the RF of hundreds of devices.

LOL. This is about Lufthansa getting dragged in the media about their baggage handling screw ups and ongoing lying to customers about it while holding their luggage for months .

It is not - it is in fact a nothing burger. The original claim was based on a German article where someone called Lufthansa and asked if they can put AirTags in their checked-in luggage, and the Lufthansa representative answered with the existing regulation about Lithium (metal or ion) battery devices, which says they are accepted if they are completely powered off.

That's it - no one is enforcing this regulation in practice, especially not for AirTags or other small devices.

Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#189

Post by kanbara »

xd wrote: post #62

OT, kinda. My eldest kid is in the final year of UK junior school so finally cut lose to walk to and from school as is culturally acceptable here.. I gave her a phone so she could let us (mum/dad) know she was on her way home from school, deciding to go home to a friends etc.. the school caught wind and apparently it was against school policy so she was disciplined (along with a number of her peers) - the extent of w…

why is the school monitoring how kids commute and using airtags? it's not airtags fault, it's your orwellian government. this is such a dumb take i can't even.

airtags alert people when they are on someone's person that they are not registered to, on iPhone and Android.

kids commute on the train in japan, germany and other places, this is absurd.

Re: Lufthansa has not banned AirTags

#190

Post by s3p »

xd wrote: post #83
dzhiurgis wrote: post #69

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Sorry, what? Phones are tracked too. Maybe your solution is a watch, but still kinda expensive. Lost my 2yo a couple of times and each time thinking to resurrect an airtag that currently tracks junk drawer. Feel wrong and I don’t think it would work on someone who changes clothes 5 times a day.

The fact you lost your child is the basis of your argument against me, beggars belief.. a phone is not by default a device to track a kid an air tag is.. my kid is 10 and yours is 2... waaaay different situation. Edit: I lost my kid plenty of times as well.. they love to run off don't they.

I think it was just perspective. I don't see where they directly disagree with you based on their anecdote
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