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SimulaVR Has Been Subpoenaed by Meta Platforms, Inc

simulavr.com

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Re: SimulaVR Has Been Subpoenaed by Meta Platforms, Inc

#111

Post by jdgoesmarching »

colejohnson66 wrote: post #78
Roark66 wrote: post #70

If this is actually how US's justice system works it is even more bonkers than I thought. Could someone versed in this legal system explain, please? Is is any accused that can demand documents/data/free research from vaguely related third parties, or only large companies? Enquiring minds want to know!

If one is accused of antitrust practices (as Meta is by the FTC), your defense is to show that there's actually competition. It's not that Meta that wants the documents for corporate espionage (or whatever), but that they want to prove that SimulaVR is competing just fine in the market that contains Meta. This is explained in the article, which many here clearly didn't read past the headline. This is roughly the same…

Yeah, and we’re reacting to how crazy it is that Meta’s competitors are required to divulge internal documents to Meta so Meta can make a case that they aren’t anticompetitive.

> It's not that Meta that wants the documents for corporate espionage

Yes I’m sure we all trust Meta will behave ethically when given private information.

Re: SimulaVR Has Been Subpoenaed by Meta Platforms, Inc

#112

Post by incomingpain »

unnouinceput wrote: post #68
incomingpain wrote: post #48

If I were simulaVR, I would make this very painful to meta. You would put together business plans that literally say no other vendor can compete against meta. Basically confirm the anti-competition. That even that subpeona is anticompetive and an attempt to further crush them. Malicious compliance the entire way.

Isn't that what they already did with this statement? Quoting last paragraph subtitle "We're don't view ourselves in competition with Meta" is exactly that. Therefore the FTC can take that and prove FB is a monopoly, or whatever FTC end-game is.

That's what prompted my idea. Though as the other comments said, playing with fire.

Re: SimulaVR Has Been Subpoenaed by Meta Platforms, Inc

#113

Post by kanetw »

notrealyme123 wrote: post #88

I hope SimulaVR does crowdfounding the legal costs instead of folding to facebook. This is the first and yet only VR Product i am deeply interested in.

We're going to absorb the legal expenditures as part of our overall expenses, but you can crowdfund us by preordering a headset :)

Re: SimulaVR Has Been Subpoenaed by Meta Platforms, Inc

#114

Post by johnchristopher »

vlunkr wrote: post #83
Bloedcoin wrote: post #61

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Why? Google still provides android, Google maps, Gmail for free. World changing at it's time still helping people around the globe. Their research blog is fantastic and shows what they value. Google Io focus on people and security and trust. Google is much further away from evil than plenty of other companies. Did they kill stadia? Yes. Did actually anyone care? No. Because stadia didn't matter anyway.

“Free” They’re probably largely to blame for setting the precedent that Internet services should be free. And of course backed by selling user data or unsustainable venture capital backed business models.

Personally, I blame this wired article https://www.wired.com/2008/02/ff-free/

Re: SimulaVR Has Been Subpoenaed by Meta Platforms, Inc

#115

Post by lostgame »

Bloedcoin wrote: post #61
unnouinceput wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I rather give my money to Satan, or even Google I giggled. When you go from "don't be evil" to this, you know you fucked up big time. This has to be the tagline of the decade in regards to Google ("Google!, the boss of Satan", hi hi hi).

Why? Google still provides android, Google maps, Gmail for free. World changing at it's time still helping people around the globe. Their research blog is fantastic and shows what they value. Google Io focus on people and security and trust. Google is much further away from evil than plenty of other companies. Did they kill stadia? Yes. Did actually anyone care? No. Because stadia didn't matter anyway.

>> ‘free’

Don’t make us all laugh. It’s ‘free’ because the user is the product, not the service.

Re: SimulaVR Has Been Subpoenaed by Meta Platforms, Inc

#116

Post by mekkkkkk »

Algent wrote: post #80
mekkkkkk wrote: post #54

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The court decides whether a subpoena should be upheld or not. If the judge has signed off on this one, then it's all legit. Failing to comply would be contempt of court.

I'll never understand how US court system basically allow you to randomly force anyone unrelated to a case into it and suffer the legal cost. It make it so easy to weaponize any case to your advantage.

What if a ruling requires information held by someone else? Should the case just be dismissed because of lack of evidence? Having a functional justice system is probably worth some snags.

The legal cost aspect is unfortunate. However, as others have mentioned, the court probably doesn't require the assembly of new documents, but rather submission of existing ones. So while there is a cost, it's not devastating.

The interesting question is whether or not this specific subpoena has real merit, or if the court was played by Meta.

Re: SimulaVR Has Been Subpoenaed by Meta Platforms, Inc

#117

Post by hulitu »

Bloedcoin wrote: post #61
unnouinceput wrote: post #55

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I rather give my money to Satan, or even Google I giggled. When you go from "don't be evil" to this, you know you fucked up big time. This has to be the tagline of the decade in regards to Google ("Google!, the boss of Satan", hi hi hi).

Why? Google still provides android, Google maps, Gmail for free. World changing at it's time still helping people around the globe. Their research blog is fantastic and shows what they value. Google Io focus on people and security and trust. Google is much further away from evil than plenty of other companies. Did they kill stadia? Yes. Did actually anyone care? No. Because stadia didn't matter anyway.

> Google still provides android, Google maps, Gmail for free.

I paid for the phone and they are still collecting my data. For me this is not free.

Re: SimulaVR Has Been Subpoenaed by Meta Platforms, Inc

#118

Post by onepointsixC »

unnouinceput wrote: post #68
incomingpain wrote: post #48

If I were simulaVR, I would make this very painful to meta. You would put together business plans that literally say no other vendor can compete against meta. Basically confirm the anti-competition. That even that subpeona is anticompetive and an attempt to further crush them. Malicious compliance the entire way.

Isn't that what they already did with this statement? Quoting last paragraph subtitle "We're don't view ourselves in competition with Meta" is exactly that. Therefore the FTC can take that and prove FB is a monopoly, or whatever FTC end-game is.

That sounds like a bold faced lie to me. To quote the article:

>Meta sells reasonably good gaming headsets to customers who want to be entertained in VR; we're selling general-purpose productivity devices which are aimed at replacing PCs and laptops. So our real competition is laptops & PCs, not other gaming headsets.

Everything Meta has been releasing publicly about their VR Headset plans make it blatantly clear that it is not only targeting gaming.

Re: SimulaVR Has Been Subpoenaed by Meta Platforms, Inc

#119

Post by TedDoesntTalk »

dsign wrote: post #27

This is not Meta demanding to see some privilege information that exists in Simula's drawers, but rather commandeering the entire competing organization to do market research for Meta. It is clever and evil, and nothing anybody says after this will make me think that Meta is not anti-competitive nor that they have an once of ethics. As a consumer, I doubt I will ever again consider their VR products; I rather give my…

This is a subpoena from a legal team, NOT a court. You are free to write “we don’t know” for much of the questions or even write “too burdensome to answer”. Such subpoenas have little teeth.

Hire a lawyer for a few hours to confirm what I say since I’m some random internet guy.

Re: SimulaVR Has Been Subpoenaed by Meta Platforms, Inc

#120

Post by bombcar »

ajross wrote: post #108
bombcar wrote: post #103

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Costs don't have anything to do with being sued or not. A subpoena to a person is relatively easy to respond to (unless you need a lawyer to help you negotiate the fifth amendment for reasons), but this will cost time and money, both things that we all know startups have in vast quantities. If the answer is not Meta pays, then why isn't it?

I told you: The recipient pays as part of their civic duty. If you want protection under the law for your own grievances, you need to be prepared to assist the court in the adjudication of the grievances of others. And the practical reason is that poor people have the right to petition courts for redress of grievances too . You're upset because Zuckerberg happens to be rich, so this seems unfair. But what if the star…

At some point, yes, otherwise it can and will be abused, just like patent lawsuits already are.

There are cases of this already happening in the case of poor people, otherwise vexatious litigants wouldn't exist.

I wonder if the judge even knew that one of the list of companies was "small company mctinypants" or just assumed all were massive and huge.

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