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Some Asians' college strategy: Don't check 'Asian'

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Re: Some Asians' college strategy: Don't check 'Asian'

#91

Post by FaceKicker »

temphn wrote: post #49

According to PBS, Race is an Illusion: http://www.pbs.org/race/000_General/000_00-Home.htm Jared Diamond concurs: http://www.learntoquestion.com/resources/database/archives/0... If you believe their arguments, there is no scientific basis for categorizing someone on the basis of race. Appearance is particularly hazardous. Therefore, why can't Asians mark black on the application? Who is to say they are not black if t…

I don't think you even need to get into the "race is an illusion" argument to self-identify as a different race. I remember when I applied, all the applications asked the question with phrasing like "Which race do you consider yourself?" I wondered if there would be any consequence if I answered Black or Hispanic (I'm white). Probably not, I'd think, as they can't prove I don't "consider myself" one of those.

Surprising that it doesn't happen more often. Or maybe it does...

Re: Some Asians' college strategy: Don't check 'Asian'

#92

Post by gbog »

BlackJack wrote: post #25

Full disclaimer: I'm a sophomore at Yale, my adviser last year was an admissions officer, and a friend of mine works in the admissions office. I'm also friends with the girl photographed, but that's irrelevant :) This is roughly how admissions works at Yale: 1. An officer reviews your application for 20-25 minutes. 1a. Some kids are clear rejects. 1500/2400 SAT and a 2.7 GPA, with no activities usually does the trick…

> I don't think checking "Asian" or "not Asian" makes a huge difference,

Not checking this box shows an aspect of your personality, maybe the differenciator you're looking for.

Re: Some Asians' college strategy: Don't check 'Asian'

#93

Post by chegra84 »

sliverstorm wrote: post #70
barrkel wrote: post #53

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The myth of equality of opportunity is indeed to be protected; but it is a myth, because uncountably more opportunities are afforded to the children of the privileged - things like affirmative action are tiny in the overall scale. I really don't like what you are insinuating. You appear to be implying that some people are inferior due to the ancestry of their parents, or the daily practices of their parents. You shou…

I really don't like what you are insinuating. You appear to be implying that some people are inferior due to the ancestry of their parents Is this just willful blindness? Do you really believe all ethnicity are perfectly matched in their potential? It's hard to study academia because we don't understand the brain well enough, but do a little reading about ethnicity and genetics as it relates to sports.

"In the mosaic of America, three groups that have been unusually successful are Asian-Americans, Jews and West Indian blacks — and in that there may be some lessons for the rest of us."

http://www.nytimes.com/2009/06/07/opinion/07kristof.html?_r=...

"Do African immigrants make the smartest Americans? The question may sound outlandish, but if you were judging by statistics alone, you could find plenty of evidence to back it up. In a side-by-side comparison of 2000 census data by sociologist John R. Logan at the Mumford Center, State University of New York at Albany, black immigrants from Africa average the highest educational attainment of any population group in the country, including whites and Asians."

http://thesouthern.com/news/opinion/editorial/page/article_2...

I think it is more cultural than genetics.

Re: Some Asians' college strategy: Don't check 'Asian'

#94

Post by nivertech »

dennisgorelik wrote: post #72

I wonder how it would work out if Asian applicant self-identifies herself as African-American?

This guy "won him the title of president of the Black Student Union, despite not being, well, black" [1]

[1] http://www.fastcompany.com/magazine/160/bill-nguyen-startups

Re: Some Asians' college strategy: Don't check 'Asian'

#96

Post by microarchitect »

reinhardt wrote: post #37
jpdoctor wrote: post #14

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't understand why they require ethnic proportions to stay close to population averages. Thank god, I hope it means the world is a different place. First, I'm guessing you're about 30 yo. (Sorry if I'm way off.) When I applied to colleges in late 1981, there were still some dumbass amounts of discrimination for being black. Affirmative action occurred in the 60s/70s to try and rectify some of that. It was a giv…

The more common downside is that some qualified guys are passed up in favor of others that are just "promising" but have the right skin color.

I don't know if this is a downside.

First a bit of background. I come from India where they practice reservation which I think would be considered much "worse" than affirmative action over here. The way the system works is that a certain percentage of seats are reserved for people from certain (usually lower castes). So for my engineering examination, I wrote a common exam conducted by the government along with about 80,000 other students from my state. Among the 80,000 about 35k or so did well enough to be given a "rank". The rank means exactly what you think it means.

Now, students are allowed to choose the college they want to go to in the order of their ranks. However, reservation means that people like me, who don't "have a reservation" have to choose seats from the general quota. The general quota was, believe it or not, 20% of all seats. Out of my class of 140 EE students, we had 29 students who came through the general quota. About 15 more seats were available to students who were willing to do without the government subsidy.

Side note: Because my education was subsidized by the state government, I paid about $300 dollars a year in fees. The ones who went without the subsidy paid about $1200 dollars a year. All

All the remaining 100 or so seats were reserved for people from one or another of the reserved castes. For people in the general quota, the lowest (highest numerically) rank admitted to my department was 114. For a person coming from a reserved quota, the lowest rank admitted was 29xx.

At the time I felt this was grossly unfair. I busted my ass to be ranked in the top 100 among 80,000 candidates to get into this place and these guys were admitting students who weren't even in the top 2000 simply because they were born into the right family.

Over time, I've come to realize that I enjoyed a great many privileges these other kids did not. I had sporadic access to the internet, I had parents who were reasonably supportive of my studies, I knew English really well. I didn't get the 90th rank simply because I was awesome. I got it because I was lucky enough to be born with (some) privilege in a third-world country.

Many of my classmates from disadvantaged backgrounds have gone on to become competent engineers. I realize now that they fully deserved their chance.

Re: Some Asians' college strategy: Don't check 'Asian'

#97

Post by realitygrill »

clvv wrote: post #27

An asian high school senior here. I'm currently in the process of applying to colleges. In most college applications, demographics are listed under the section where they say the information you provide won't hurt your change of getting in. I have not and will not lie about my race on any of the applications. I understand that, statistically, it will hurt my chance of getting into a top-tier college, considering I do…

Wisdom is rare, and not easily discerned. Tread carefully.

Re: Some Asians' college strategy: Don't check 'Asian'

#99

Post by cbrauchli »

_pius wrote: post #78
adgar wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> I don't think checking "Asian" or "not Asian" makes a huge difference, because in the end, it's your activities, recommendations, and essays that differentiate you. This flies in the face of the fact that affirmative actions exists and that the racial demographics at any given college are typically consistent year-to-year. Somehow the numbers get hit every single year, yet you claim it's an inherent property of the…

This flies in the face of the fact that affirmative actions exists and that the racial demographics at any given college are typically consistent year-to-year. Not if you know how affirmative action actually works.

How does it actually work?

Re: Some Asians' college strategy: Don't check 'Asian'

#100

Post by dennisgorelik »

nivertech wrote: post #94
dennisgorelik wrote: post #72

I wonder how it would work out if Asian applicant self-identifies herself as African-American?

This guy "won him the title of president of the Black Student Union, despite not being, well, black" [1] [1] http://www.fastcompany.com/magazine/160/bill-nguyen-startups

Thanks. So Bill Nguyen proved that it's possible to self-identify yourself under different race.

University Admission Committee may not mind such "self race re-branding" practice too, because university ratios of admitted minorities would be improving as well.

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