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Europe braces for mobile network blackouts

reuters.com

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Re: Europe braces for mobile network blackouts

#391

Post by hef19898 »

rr888 wrote: post #362
hef19898 wrote: post #353

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Barbarossa might have a word with you... And the Holocaust only got really going after that. So how again were Germany and Russia friendly during WW2?

> So how again were Germany and Russia friendly during WW2? https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Molotov%E2%80%93Ribbentrop_Pac... https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/German%E2%80%93Soviet_Boundary...

On the other hand:

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Barbarossa

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Case_Blue

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Stalingrad

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Battle_of_Kursk

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Operation_Bagration

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Siege_of_Leningrad

Just some friendly highlights. Feel free too look up all the others.

Re: Europe braces for mobile network blackouts

#392

Post by medo-bear »

mensetmanusman wrote: post #358
Jon_Lowtek wrote: post #287

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This has nothing to do with scapegoating, the US military literally attacked european infrastructure this week

It was probably Russia, Germany would be to pissed if Biden did that

i agree. the us cares so much about what germany thinks

Re: Europe braces for mobile network blackouts

#393

Post by DiogenesKynikos »

Maursault wrote: post #375
DiogenesKynikos wrote: post #349

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Estimates of total deaths in Iraq due to the war generally come up with a figure of several hundred thousand. You can look at the page you linked to for examples of these studies. Iraq Body Count tracked 120k individually verifiable civilian deaths in Iraq through 2011 (a figure that has increased significantly since, due to the rise of ISIS, which was a side-effect of the Iraq War). But in a war zone, many (maybe ev…

While most estimates are between 150K to 250K, with at least one published estimate as high as 1.2M, the point of the quote was not to argue about causality numbers, but to demonstrate that numbers are "highly disputed," with an example of a lower estimate and claim of consensus. IBC project in particular has issues, including accusations of internal anti-war bias and biased sources. IBC has been accused of both unde…

Most scientific estimates are in the range of half a million to a million, with the one outlier being the study conducted by the Iraqi Health Ministry itself. One possible explanation for that is that people might have been afraid to speak to representatives of the ministry, given that it was controlled by a Shiite politician who had connections to militias.

Re: Europe braces for mobile network blackouts

#394

Post by hef19898 »

ch4s3 wrote: post #376
hef19898 wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was no turn to Russia, the USSR was a reliable gas supplier since the 60s and all the way through the Cold War...

It’s a matter of public record that France and Germany were aligning towards Russia and away from the US geopolitically. They referred to it as “the troika”.

Past tense, I still don't see why this was wrong back the day. Also, I never said Europe didn't form closer ties with Russia. I still think thisbis a, generally, good idea. One that is just impossible in the current situation and under the current Russian leadership. Long term so, it is still a viable strategy. Isolating Russia for good is a bad option, IMHO.

That being said, Russia has to end the war in Ukraine, retreat from the occupied territories. And the West has to do some soul searching once this happened, our track record when it comes to invasions and occupations isn't that great in the last 20 odd years.

Re: Europe braces for mobile network blackouts

#395

Post by voidr »

This is extremely irresponsible, how are you supposed to make a call if you have an emergency? People are going to die.

The EU needs to recognise the situation: this is not working, 15% of Ukraine is now part of Russia despite all the NATO help.

Meanwhile the US is laughing as the dollar is rising above everything and the media is un-ironically saying that it could have been the US who blew up the pipelines in the Baltic Sea.

Re: Europe braces for mobile network blackouts

#396

Post by DiogenesKynikos »

ch4s3 wrote: post #378
DiogenesKynikos wrote: post #271

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I cannot see how one can claim that the US invasion of Iraq was less barbaric than the Russian invasion of the Ukraine. First of all, hundreds of thousands of Iraqis died. The US practiced torture, as we all found out when the pictures of Abu Ghraib came out. The US worked with Shiite militias that conducted ethnic cleansing and torture on a massive scale. The US put down uprisings in places like Sadr City, Najaf and…

The collateral murder video was a national scandal, people were appalled and it was fairly unique among a trove of videos and documents. Ukraine is unearthing mass graves on a daily basis full of mutilated civilians. The laundry list of confirmed war crimes including video is overwhelming. There’s loads of evidence of people all the way up the Russian chain of command encouraging atrocities. Moreover the conflict is…

A national scandal? There were never any consequences, except for the people who brought the video to light.

The US was involved in plenty of war crimes in Iraq, such as the following documented cases:

0. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Mukaradeeb_wedding_party_massa...

1. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Haditha_massacre

2. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nisour_Square_massacre

3. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fallujah_killings_of_April_200...

4. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ishaqi_incident

The US worked with militias, such as the Wolf Brigade, that were notorious for conducting torture (in particular, it has come out that US forces passed on detainees to the Wolf Brigade for torture).[5] At the height of the war, bodies were being dumped in the open every day in Baghdad with gruesome signs of torture.

5. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wolf_Brigade_(Iraq)

Re: Europe braces for mobile network blackouts

#397

Post by DiogenesKynikos »

ch4s3 wrote: post #376
hef19898 wrote: post #314

Earlier quoted context omitted.

There was no turn to Russia, the USSR was a reliable gas supplier since the 60s and all the way through the Cold War...

It’s a matter of public record that France and Germany were aligning towards Russia and away from the US geopolitically. They referred to it as “the troika”.

That's somewhat of an exaggeration. There were "troika" meetings in the late 1990s and in 2003, but France and Germany remained in the US' orbit.

The Iraq War was probably the time of maximum German/French political autonomy, when they publicly opposed the US on a major issue, but there's very little of that spirit left. France and Germany have hitched themselves even more strongly to the US now, to the point that the German foreign minister is talking about decoupling from China (a policy that makes no rational sense for Germany, but which signals that Germany sides with the US in the geopolitical rivalry).

As far as their attitude towards Russia goes, Germany and France have had terrible relations with Russia since 2014, at the latest. Germany tried not to sever all economic ties with Russia, and it tried to negotiate a settlement to the war in the Donbas, but that doesn't mean that relations were friendly.

Re: Europe braces for mobile network blackouts

#398

Post by LunaSea »

Schroedingersat wrote: post #381
f1shy wrote: post #171

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think ideology. "Green movement"

Torpedoing wind projects and investing more in gas pipelines and generators is exactly what the green movement was about.

Well Greenpeace is selling gas so it seems to be yes.

Re: Europe braces for mobile network blackouts

#399

Post by megous »

hef19898 wrote: post #347
megous wrote: post #340

Earlier quoted context omitted.

https://www.dw.com/en/rheinmetall-poised-to-honor-military-d...

Some quick numbers: 2020/21 exports of weapons from EU cointries to Russia were aroind 100 million (or thereabouts, might even include icebreakers, good luck using those for conquering Mariupol). Since February 2022 EU countries committed to send 2.5 billion of military gear to the Ukrainian forces. I guess details and context still matter.

Context is also that Russia trained their invasion forces in a modern German built facility.

Re: Europe braces for mobile network blackouts

#400

Post by hef19898 »

megous wrote: post #399
hef19898 wrote: post #347

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Some quick numbers: 2020/21 exports of weapons from EU cointries to Russia were aroind 100 million (or thereabouts, might even include icebreakers, good luck using those for conquering Mariupol). Since February 2022 EU countries committed to send 2.5 billion of military gear to the Ukrainian forces. I guess details and context still matter.

Context is also that Russia trained their invasion forces in a modern German built facility.

Unless said facility was build after 2014 I don't see the problem here. Not that the training was very successful as far as all that invasion business goes, was it?
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