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Gas Leak in the Baltic Sea

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Re: Gas Leak in the Baltic Sea

#591

Post by t0mas88 »

thiagoharry wrote: post #576
eloff wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So that doesn't look like an accident. I have difficulty imagining accidental ignition in an underwater gas pipeline. Where would the oxygen come from? Plus it's more than one explosion on the same day - can't be a coincidence. The next question is, who did it? It doesn't seem like something in Russia's interest, they've been wanting to get that pipeline approved and operational. They invested huge sums of money to b…

The USA is the country that threatened an attack against the gas pipeline. "If Russia invades, that means tanks or troops crossing the -- the border of Ukraine again, then there will be -- there will be no longer a Nord Stream 2," Biden said during the press conference with Scholz, who did not go as far as Biden, but insisted the U.S. and Germany remain "absolutely united." https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/biden-meet-…

In the context of that day it meant Germany not approving Nord Stream 2, which is what happened. He didn't mean blowing it up.

Re: Gas Leak in the Baltic Sea

#592

Post by nivenkos »

protomyth wrote: post #555
xtian wrote: post #545

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> The next question is, who did it? A Polish member of the European Parliament has thanked the US: https://twitter.com/radeksikorski/status/1574800653724966915

I somehow think the USA would have done it with a bit less big explosion solution.

Why? The USA has absolute power over Europe. This is just a demonstration of that.

No country will complain or do anything. And it'll just be forgotten about like the extraordinary renditions, the May 1947 crises, etc.

Re: Gas Leak in the Baltic Sea

#594

Post by 0x457 »

migro23 wrote: post #523
0x457 wrote: post #491

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Remove its only leverage is in Russia's interest? Until now, there was a possibility that EU get tired and get bend over. Now that possibility is gone.

That possibility is long gone. Damaging the Nord Stream pipeline however gives Putin reason to continue to not supply gas (rather than flat out breaking existing contracts) hence maximising the possibility for civil disruption in Europe over the Winter. The less gas there is in Europe the more chance of this occurring. No one knows for sure at this point but all these comments on this thread that there isn't reason o…

87.7% of EU gas storage is filled[1]. Which is pretty close to how it is usually every winter. Germany is at 91%.

Russia wasn't supplying gas via Nord Stream 1, claiming it needs maintenance and sanctions preventing this maintenance. Which is well...true[2]? Six turbines were stuck in Canada due to sanctions.

There are many ways to not supply gas to Germany and not break the contract that does not involve damaging nearly 20 billion dollar infrastructure (NS1 + NS2).

There a reasons and motives to do so, buy IMO none of them outweigh the damage.

> That possibility is long gone.

No, it's not. You contradict yourself in the very next sentence.

[1]: https://graphics.reuters.com/UKRAINE-CRISIS/EUROPE-GAS/zdvxo...

[2]: https://www.reuters.com/business/energy/russias-gazprom-says...

Re: Gas Leak in the Baltic Sea

#596

Post by postalrat »

some0x80070005 wrote: post #528
bradgessler wrote: post #310

Does anybody know what this means in terms of bringing the pipeline back online? I'm assuming it's filling with seawater, which seems like it would cause all sorts of problems between the salt and debris. Is it a matter of repairing the breaches, removing the water, cleaning the pipeline out, and pressurizing it or is this pipeline effectively destroyed?

Due to the special inside coating to reduce friction, seawater ingress would mean the abandonment of the pipeline. It’s just not possible to fix the line without just replacing the entire thing. I theorize it’s possible to run at severely reduced flow rates if they were able to get the water out, but that seems unlikely since the receiving facilities are not designed to handle the tremendous amount of water that woul…

You would think they would have valves or whatever along the pipeline. In case they need to shut off section.

Re: Gas Leak in the Baltic Sea

#597

Post by woodruffw »

thiagoharry wrote: post #576
eloff wrote: post #113

Earlier quoted context omitted.

So that doesn't look like an accident. I have difficulty imagining accidental ignition in an underwater gas pipeline. Where would the oxygen come from? Plus it's more than one explosion on the same day - can't be a coincidence. The next question is, who did it? It doesn't seem like something in Russia's interest, they've been wanting to get that pipeline approved and operational. They invested huge sums of money to b…

The USA is the country that threatened an attack against the gas pipeline. "If Russia invades, that means tanks or troops crossing the -- the border of Ukraine again, then there will be -- there will be no longer a Nord Stream 2," Biden said during the press conference with Scholz, who did not go as far as Biden, but insisted the U.S. and Germany remain "absolutely united." https://abcnews.go.com/Politics/biden-meet-…

It's a serious stretch to read this as threatening an attack on the pipeline itself. Not only is it from over 6 months ago, but it doesn't make any sense: NS2 is controlled by the Germans themselves, and there's no strategic value in blowing it up rather than just turning it off (or on).

The more sensible interpretation is that Biden was threatening to fully support Germany's plans to become energy independent. And that's, so far, what we've seen the US commit to.

Re: Gas Leak in the Baltic Sea

#599

Post by ajsnigrutin »

throwrqX wrote: post #409
ajsnigrutin wrote: post #203

Earlier quoted context omitted.

A couple of years of ukranians shelling the prorussian regions were a good enough reason.... considering that nato used the same one to bomb serbia in 1999.

Any evidence for genocides of pro-Russian populations in Donbas similar to Serbia's of Albanians?

What genocide? It was a fight against KLA, a group even americans marked as terrorists.

Re: Gas Leak in the Baltic Sea

#600

Post by blablabla123 »

kstenerud wrote: post #90

If I were a betting man, I'd put my money on Poland. The Polish prime minister immediately called "sabotage" and fingered Russia, while everyone else is still saying "it could be sabotage but we need to investigate first". Russia wants the taps capable of being turned ON at their discretion, not permanently broken. This hurts their bargaining position in a big way because they've just lost their biggest source of lev…

> If I were a betting man, I'd put my money on Poland.

That's exactly the narrative that Russia is trying to sell now since 2 decades now. It's not the first time pipelines are damaged. Please read up on the recent history, if this year hasn't been lesson enough what then...

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