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Apple Car: Bad Idea After All

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Re: Apple Car: Bad Idea After All

#11

Post by sk55 »

ARandumGuy wrote: post #8

A full Apple Car has always seemed unrealistic to me. Cars are a fundamentally different industry then consumer electronics and software. Apple would be starting from scratch, and facing a lot of entrenched competition with huge budgets and infrastructure. And for what? What could Apple do that GM, Toyota, or Tesla couldn't? Maybe a better UX for the dashboard. And while many car UXs are absolutely terrible, improvin…

Once autonomous technology becomes mainstream, UX becomes the differentiating factor. I think Apple would have a lot to offer.

Re: Apple Car: Bad Idea After All

#13

Post by anamexis »

sk55 wrote: post #11
ARandumGuy wrote: post #8

A full Apple Car has always seemed unrealistic to me. Cars are a fundamentally different industry then consumer electronics and software. Apple would be starting from scratch, and facing a lot of entrenched competition with huge budgets and infrastructure. And for what? What could Apple do that GM, Toyota, or Tesla couldn't? Maybe a better UX for the dashboard. And while many car UXs are absolutely terrible, improvin…

Once autonomous technology becomes mainstream, UX becomes the differentiating factor. I think Apple would have a lot to offer.

And the entire rest of the car as well...

Re: Apple Car: Bad Idea After All

#14

Post by packetlost »

sk55 wrote: post #11
ARandumGuy wrote: post #8

A full Apple Car has always seemed unrealistic to me. Cars are a fundamentally different industry then consumer electronics and software. Apple would be starting from scratch, and facing a lot of entrenched competition with huge budgets and infrastructure. And for what? What could Apple do that GM, Toyota, or Tesla couldn't? Maybe a better UX for the dashboard. And while many car UXs are absolutely terrible, improvin…

Once autonomous technology becomes mainstream, UX becomes the differentiating factor. I think Apple would have a lot to offer.

The winds don't seem to be blowing in the direction of true autonomous driving through. The hype cycle seems to have died down and the sense of reality is setting in.

Re: Apple Car: Bad Idea After All

#15

Post by soperj »

sk55 wrote: post #11
ARandumGuy wrote: post #8

A full Apple Car has always seemed unrealistic to me. Cars are a fundamentally different industry then consumer electronics and software. Apple would be starting from scratch, and facing a lot of entrenched competition with huge budgets and infrastructure. And for what? What could Apple do that GM, Toyota, or Tesla couldn't? Maybe a better UX for the dashboard. And while many car UXs are absolutely terrible, improvin…

Once autonomous technology becomes mainstream, UX becomes the differentiating factor. I think Apple would have a lot to offer.

I don't exactly see Apple as a AI powerhouse, maybe that's coloured by Siri though.

Re: Apple Car: Bad Idea After All

#16

Post by martythemaniak »

SV_BubbleTime wrote: post #4

Automotive EE here… any article that talks about Tesla’s financials even indirectly and it does not immediately mention how much money they make by selling carbon credits back to GM Ford and Stellantis can pay immediately be disregarded. A casual look at the numbers doesn’t explain much. But if you look at that 7% margin, and realize that Tesla is nearly doubling that with carbon credit sales which are 100% margin. I…

Those credits aren't particularly relevant any more. Several years ago they were essential and made up practically the entirety of their profits, but today they're just a side-gig. In Q2'2022: $300m credits, $16 billion in total revenue, 2.3B in profit.

Re: Apple Car: Bad Idea After All

#17

Post by kkaske »

bushbaba wrote: post #7
SV_BubbleTime wrote: post #4

Automotive EE here… any article that talks about Tesla’s financials even indirectly and it does not immediately mention how much money they make by selling carbon credits back to GM Ford and Stellantis can pay immediately be disregarded. A casual look at the numbers doesn’t explain much. But if you look at that 7% margin, and realize that Tesla is nearly doubling that with carbon credit sales which are 100% margin. I…

Wouldn’t people have said the same with mp3 players back in the day. Honestly the biggest challenge will be manufacturing. Apple likes to surprise folks, how do you surprise them when you’ve got to build massive new factories

Wouldn't people have said the same thing with cell phones back in the day? In fact I had a discussion with an Apple store employee asking what they thought about the rumor that Apple was going to be releasing a phone. He said that there was no way Apple would even want to be in that space. I'm not saying they will get into cars, but you just never know.

Re: Apple Car: Bad Idea After All

#18

Post by aclatuts »

martythemaniak wrote: post #16
SV_BubbleTime wrote: post #4

Automotive EE here… any article that talks about Tesla’s financials even indirectly and it does not immediately mention how much money they make by selling carbon credits back to GM Ford and Stellantis can pay immediately be disregarded. A casual look at the numbers doesn’t explain much. But if you look at that 7% margin, and realize that Tesla is nearly doubling that with carbon credit sales which are 100% margin. I…

Those credits aren't particularly relevant any more. Several years ago they were essential and made up practically the entirety of their profits, but today they're just a side-gig. In Q2'2022: $300m credits, $16 billion in total revenue, 2.3B in profit.

I was just going to say this. The credits definitely do not double their margins, it adds 2% to their 11% base margin for a total of 13%

Re: Apple Car: Bad Idea After All

#19

Post by ghaff »

germinalphrase wrote: post #6
ghaff wrote: post #2

Possible CarPlay expansion aside--I can't even summon up a good devil's advocate argument for this. I was having a discussion over the weekend over where Apple goes next with respect to hardware. I think my money is on AR if the many technical limitations can be overcome. There are also the social issues but as with many other things, I suspect a lot of people would be willing to put up with even more ubiquitous came…

Setting aside technicals issues as a huge caveat, the promise of AR is massive. I'm actually somewhat surprised that we're not seeing more AR focused media to prime people to the possibilities (but maybe we're just too early).

Probably too early although we've seen some attempts with AR apps on phones.

As you say, technical is a huge caveat. But it's pretty easy to see that IF we could have glasses that could overlay/enhance/record/etc. there are so many possibilities in a way there aren't with VR for example--for both consumer and commercial uses. By contrast, VR seems pretty limited; immersive gaming and virtual tourism just aren't that interesting for most people. And people don't want immersion in a lot of circumstances.

When you can envision a clear market based on "just" relatively straightforward (if significant) extrapolations of technology that seems something worth paying attention to.

Re: Apple Car: Bad Idea After All

#20

Post by meltyness »

If it's something they officially give up on: Good. There's no sense in trying to further extend mega caps. If there were really a litany of issues with how vehicles were made, one would expect investment to appear in research and development that addresses those specific issues, not vehicles appearing out of capital groundswells from disasters.

It's alarming that the media doesn't call this what it is: a sell signal, and a clear sign that stock buybacks, collusion, and scared FTC beauraucrats who aren't willing to throw down the antitrust flag are making a sick economy sicker.

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