Adversarial Collaboration
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Adversarial Collaboration
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Re: Adversarial Collaboration
#2> Let's start from the main domains where we know people don't change their minds—politics or religion.
> In politics and in religion, the main driver is social. We believe what the people we love and trust believe.
Except I've changed my mind on both, despite enormous pressure by people I love not to.
Also this article seems to be self-defeating: if we don't change our minds, why attempt to convince us of that fact? If we truly don't change our minds, no amount of evidence will help us change our minds about this topic.
Re: Adversarial Collaboration
#3One of the most disappointing things that I have learned is that most people hold opinions in order to be part of some group. If someone is a member of a group, it is almost not worth listening to their arguments, especially arguments in support of views held strongly by that group. They are arguing in order to maintain their group membership, not to find the truth. It appears this is true of academic and scientific disciplines as much as anywhere else.
Re: Adversarial Collaboration
#4One of the most disappointing things that I have learned is that most people hold opinions in order to be part of some group. If someone is a member of a group, it is almost not worth listening to their arguments, especially arguments in support of views held strongly by that group. They are arguing in order to maintain their group membership, not to find the truth. It appears this is true of academic and scientific…
Yes. And if someone knows books or discussions about this topic I want the names. Its such a strong force in social structures. Stating your truth is rarely possible, you better sing along and talk down in smaller sub groups later.
Re: Adversarial Collaboration
#5I know this isn’t exactly a counterpoint, since “The belief will not change when the reasons are defeated. The causality is reversed. People believe the reasons because they believe in the conclusion.” — but I have changed my political views dramatically and repeatedly over the course of the past decades. Of course, I could disprove the conclusion by accepting it based on the evidence, but I don’t want the universe to collapse in on itself due to paradox, so I won’t.
Re: Adversarial Collaboration
#6> Let's start from the main domains where we know people don't change their minds—politics or religion. > In politics and in religion, the main driver is social. We believe what the people we love and trust believe. Except I've changed my mind on both, despite enormous pressure by people I love not to. Also this article seems to be self-defeating: if we don't change our minds, why attempt to convince us of that fact?…
I don't think it was meant as an absolutist assertion.
Re: Adversarial Collaboration
#7One of the most disappointing things that I have learned is that most people hold opinions in order to be part of some group. If someone is a member of a group, it is almost not worth listening to their arguments, especially arguments in support of views held strongly by that group. They are arguing in order to maintain their group membership, not to find the truth. It appears this is true of academic and scientific…
I think it is the other way around. When people are part of a group the view of the group becomes their own. Most of the thoughts that you think aren't really your own. It is simply a script written by the society around you.
For example: Someone born and brought up in the West would think that children don't owe anything to their parents because it was their parent's choice to have them.
While someone born and brought up in the East would think that they owe everything to their parents because they gave them the gift of life and because of all the sacrifices they made for their kids.
You can't convince someone in the West to think anything otherwise than that stated above. They are utterly convinced that that is is truth and likewise the reverse for someone born and brought up in the East.
Re: Adversarial Collaboration
#8One of the most disappointing things that I have learned is that most people hold opinions in order to be part of some group. If someone is a member of a group, it is almost not worth listening to their arguments, especially arguments in support of views held strongly by that group. They are arguing in order to maintain their group membership, not to find the truth. It appears this is true of academic and scientific…
I think it is the other way around. When people are part of a group the view of the group becomes their own. Most of the thoughts that you think aren't really your own. It is simply a script written by the society around you. For example: Someone born and brought up in the West would think that children don't owe anything to their parents because it was their parent's choice to have them. While someone born and broug…
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Re: Adversarial Collaboration
#9One of the most disappointing things that I have learned is that most people hold opinions in order to be part of some group. If someone is a member of a group, it is almost not worth listening to their arguments, especially arguments in support of views held strongly by that group. They are arguing in order to maintain their group membership, not to find the truth. It appears this is true of academic and scientific…
Why did you point out academics and scientific disciplines specifically even though you said it happens everywhere?
Re: Adversarial Collaboration
#10One of the most disappointing things that I have learned is that most people hold opinions in order to be part of some group. If someone is a member of a group, it is almost not worth listening to their arguments, especially arguments in support of views held strongly by that group. They are arguing in order to maintain their group membership, not to find the truth. It appears this is true of academic and scientific…
I think it is the other way around. When people are part of a group the view of the group becomes their own. Most of the thoughts that you think aren't really your own. It is simply a script written by the society around you. For example: Someone born and brought up in the West would think that children don't owe anything to their parents because it was their parent's choice to have them. While someone born and broug…
But not everyone holds that view based on where they live. So how do you those are the prevalent views?