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Kazakhstan’s president: We’re moving full speed ahead toward reform

politico.eu

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Re: Kazakhstan’s president: We’re moving full speed ahead toward reform

#31

Post by DoItToMe81 »

gkya wrote: post #25
ftl64 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Things aren't actually as clear-cut as you say. While protests started out peacefully things quickly escalated into violence, especially in Almaty. Most notably, armed bandits captured the city's airport, burned most of the government buildings, tried to assault multiple law enforcement agency offices, tried to go live on multiple TV channels, robbed ATMs, etc. The government has promised a large-scale investigation…

Quoted post unavailable.

Some civilians had their heads sawed off with machetes.

Re: Kazakhstan’s president: We’re moving full speed ahead toward reform

#32

Post by Larrikin »

ftl64 wrote: post #29
gkya wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

It is sure easy to make political comments on countries that you know so little about, know no one from and have never been to. fyi, I am from Almaty and been in the city in January. Can you even imagine how it felt here, waking up from gunfire in the night, having no internet and mobile connection, no means of getting in touch with people you care about, wondering if tomorrow you will still have running water, elect…

It's sounds like a protests in every other country.

Re: Kazakhstan’s president: We’re moving full speed ahead toward reform

#33

Post by yorwba »

yawaramin wrote: post #30

Good luck with the reform but without approval voting or similar electoral reform, they risk getting stuck with a polarized political system and electorate (much like the US now).

Kazakhstan is already using proportional representation: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/2021_Kazakh_legislative_electi...

The bigger problem so far have been restrictions on which parties are allowed to run in the first place. (Hence Tokayev's statement that "We’re ushering in a new era of pluralism by abolishing constraints on the registration and formation of political parties.")

Re: Kazakhstan’s president: We’re moving full speed ahead toward reform

#34

Post by voz_ »

gkya wrote: post #25
ftl64 wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Things aren't actually as clear-cut as you say. While protests started out peacefully things quickly escalated into violence, especially in Almaty. Most notably, armed bandits captured the city's airport, burned most of the government buildings, tried to assault multiple law enforcement agency offices, tried to go live on multiple TV channels, robbed ATMs, etc. The government has promised a large-scale investigation…

Quoted post unavailable.

No post body was provided.

Re: Kazakhstan’s president: We’re moving full speed ahead toward reform

#35

Post by gtsop »

ftl64 wrote: post #17
lowkey_ wrote: post #6

For anyone unaware, earlier this year, Kazakhstan faced protests over gas prices (it was a tipping point, there's a lot of wealth inequality) and this president requested the help of Russian security forces to enter the country and help quell riots, and they ended up killing rioters [1]. Most of my Kazakh friends were rooting for the rioters, wanting a more free Kazakhstan, while one friend close to the government wa…

Things aren't actually as clear-cut as you say. While protests started out peacefully things quickly escalated into violence, especially in Almaty. Most notably, armed bandits captured the city's airport, burned most of the government buildings, tried to assault multiple law enforcement agency offices, tried to go live on multiple TV channels, robbed ATMs, etc. The government has promised a large-scale investigation…

Seems pretty clear cut to me. Rioting implies violence. The examples you noted are bound to happen durring such times.

Re: Kazakhstan’s president: We’re moving full speed ahead toward reform

#36

Post by gkya »

ftl64 wrote: post #29
gkya wrote: post #25

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Quoted post unavailable.

It is sure easy to make political comments on countries that you know so little about, know no one from and have never been to. fyi, I am from Almaty and been in the city in January. Can you even imagine how it felt here, waking up from gunfire in the night, having no internet and mobile connection, no means of getting in touch with people you care about, wondering if tomorrow you will still have running water, elect…

Yeah that's definitely what it was. I'm no westerner, so I know what this looks like and what local fascists interpret it as. Tell your stories to someone else.

Also, quoting your link:

"According to the Alma-Ata police, on the morning of January 6, dozens of rioters were killed during the storming of administrative buildings in the city and its environs."

Re: Kazakhstan’s president: We’re moving full speed ahead toward reform

#37

Post by vbezhenar »

ftl64 wrote: post #19
lowkey_ wrote: post #6

For anyone unaware, earlier this year, Kazakhstan faced protests over gas prices (it was a tipping point, there's a lot of wealth inequality) and this president requested the help of Russian security forces to enter the country and help quell riots, and they ended up killing rioters [1]. Most of my Kazakh friends were rooting for the rioters, wanting a more free Kazakhstan, while one friend close to the government wa…

Also, nowhere in the article it says that Russian security forces ended up killing rioters.

According to official sources, Russian forces were dislocated to guard important objects which allowed Kazakh forces to quell the terrorists and take situation under control. So Russian forces did not engage in the actual fight, but rather backed up Kazakh forces.

What really happened is that Kazakh military did not want to obey the President orders when this chaos started. It's speculated that this was act of treason by some high officials in an attempt of coup. That's why Tokaev asked Russia to intervene. After Russia confirmed that they actually do support Tokaev with some symbolic forces sent, Kazakh military started to obey the orders and started to actually do what they must. That's my opinion.

Re: Kazakhstan’s president: We’re moving full speed ahead toward reform

#38

Post by breitling »

mcfedr wrote: post #23
ClumsyPilot wrote: post #20

Earlier quoted context omitted.

they are kind of 'Surrounded' by Russia and China, there is no other route from Kazahstan to the rest of the world Look at the map, the only other border they have is with a litany of failed states with zero infrastructure or freedom.

Russia has infrastructure and freedom?

ok. Go easy in the kool-aid.

Re: Kazakhstan’s president: We’re moving full speed ahead toward reform

#39

Post by vbezhenar »

ur-whale wrote: post #21
Galicarnax wrote: post #9

As someone actually living in Kazakhstan, I would not take any words of the current government too seriously.

> As someone actually living in Kazakhstan, I would not take any words of the current government too seriously. When providing such strong contrarian opinion, it is customary, or even expected to provide some sort of backing rationale ...

When you hear that your government is going to do a groundbreaking reforms. Every few years. After a while you'll get some tolerance to those claims.
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