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Linux on the laptop works so damn well that it’s boring

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Re: Linux on the laptop works so damn well that it’s boring

#211

Post by unpopularopp »

btdmaster wrote: post #129
unpopularopp wrote: post #61

I wish Ubuntu didn't kill Wubi tho. We used that at my first workplace on laptops with Windows and it was so damn good. There is a new fork [0] but it's a hit and miss with modern UEFI and especially with Windows 11 (had to use it for some reason). And other distros never had an option like this afaik, none does as of today. But I know it's all about Docker, VMs, or WSL nowadays yet Wubi covered a niche segment which…

UNetbootin[1] still works fine last I tried it. [1] https://unetbootin.github.io/

But that sounds like a totally different use case.

Wubi installed the whole distro into a local file on your drive + it worked natively.

Re: Linux on the laptop works so damn well that it’s boring

#212

Post by II2II »

darthrupert wrote: post #50
ufmace wrote: post #42

I have a feeling that the overall reality is far more hit-or-miss than the author implies. If you happen to be lucky to have all hardware that Linux supports well, then everything does work nicely (which is infact a nice improvement over the early days). If you get unlucky on your hardware, well buckle up, it's gonna be a ride. You are of course more likely to have good hardware support on very old devices. Windows h…

Anecdote time. I have a gaming laptop from Asus, 2022 model. It keeps hard crashing on Windows (both 10 and 11) while working fine on Linux. Windows doesn't clearly have such an advantage anymore.

Different laptop, different issues, similar outcome. I ran into issues with Windows corrupting the EFI boot entries, even on a dedicated install. I have also had Windows fail to enter sleep or come out of sleep when the lid is closed. I have never had these issues under Linux on the same hardware.

Having investigated problems with Windows, I think it is fair to say that Linux is more reliable on supported hardware. The main problems with Linux are: some hardware is not supported, and sometimes Linux only supports a subset of the functionality of hardware it does support. If you're careful with what you buy, your experience can be just as good (if not better) under Linux. If you're not careful with what you buy, you can still luck out and have a positive experience.

Re: Linux on the laptop works so damn well that it’s boring

#213

Post by api »

mid-kid wrote: post #70

Yeah, no. Maybe with old laptops, but newer laptops still have their fair share of issues. When I bought my thinkpad A485 kernels wouldn't boot without additional parameters, the graphics would freeze at times and cause a hardlock, sleep and hibernation have been fixed and broken again intermittently over several kernel versions, the wifi card's AP mode started causing segfaults in kernel 5.2 due to the driver's rewr…

That and he says “most software has migrated to the browser.” Maybe most of what he uses, but if that’s the case then you’re basically doing a DIY Chromebook.

Re: Linux on the laptop works so damn well that it’s boring

#214

Post by ant6n »

Eleison23 wrote: post #33

In 2018 I was in college, working on a Linux degree, and studying for certifications such as CompTIA Linux+. I had allocated some funds to purchase a new machine; my desktop was already over 8 years old and I obviously wanted a good machine I could bring to campus. I chose the Lenovo ThinkPad T580, because it was on the Red Hat certified list. It came with Windows 10 but I immediately installed CentOS. This turned ou…

After years of Linux and Mac, I was issued a Win 10 machine at work. I don’t know how anybody voluntarily uses that. It’s like instead of fixing bugs over the last 30 years, they just keep adding new ones. And also make the whole experience more bloated, more confusing, more slow and still kinda ugly.

Re: Linux on the laptop works so damn well that it’s boring

#215

Post by howenterprisey »

Eleison23 wrote: post #33

In 2018 I was in college, working on a Linux degree, and studying for certifications such as CompTIA Linux+. I had allocated some funds to purchase a new machine; my desktop was already over 8 years old and I obviously wanted a good machine I could bring to campus. I chose the Lenovo ThinkPad T580, because it was on the Red Hat certified list. It came with Windows 10 but I immediately installed CentOS. This turned ou…

Hello fellow T580 user. Writing this from Arch. Never had a single issue.

Re: Linux on the laptop works so damn well that it’s boring

#216

Post by LooseMarmoset »

I gave up Windows entirely; between unavoidable telemetry, embedded ads, and poor service pack QA (especially printers), I'm done. I'm not paying to rent an O/S and sell my personal habits regardless of what Microsoft thinks I should do.

I use a Macbook Pro for work. I don't really care for MacOS, but they've got a real bash shell at least, and I like the consistency of clipboard handling in MacOS. I don't get to dictate my work environment, but thank goodness it isn't Windows.

I'm running Devuan at home on a recent AMD 550 board with a 3100, and also on an older Macbook Pro. The only real issues I have are around getting wifi working during install on Debian and Devuan, due to firmware open-ness issues. I doubt Ubuntu has these issues.

After install, though, the OP is correct, it's wonderfully boring. Install TLP and a recent 5.x kernel on laptops and power issues just disappear. Install Steam and use Proton, even with games from GoG, and everything that I own works.

It's always jarring to help someone with a normal Windows machine; the ads, the o/s response times, the forced manufacturer bloatware really shocks me.

I don't miss Windows at all.

Re: Linux on the laptop works so damn well that it’s boring

#217

Post by NegativeK »

blooalien wrote: post #155
Hellion wrote: post #116

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This comment is exactly what I mean.

Whatever… I'm glad to no longer have to fight my operating system to work with my hardware like I always had to on Windows - "Plug and Pray" was a joke for a valid reason. Installing drivers is for rubes. I'd rather plug stuff in and just get to work without going on a freakin' scavenger hunt for drivers… If you hate Linux so much, then just don't use it. Simple, yeah?

I greatly prefer Linux and use Windows when some software forces me to, but I don't feel that your comment is constructive in this conversation.

Windows is generally a smoother experience. Linux is generally not ready for the average user with a randomly picked computer, as much as we'd wish it is.

Re: Linux on the laptop works so damn well that it’s boring

#218

Post by cycomanic »

spadros wrote: post #153
vladvasiliu wrote: post #141

Earlier quoted context omitted.

This seems to me as a more generic problem with newer hardware, not specific to Linux. Likely devices rushed out the door to meet some idiotic deadline, badly specced and with incompletely implemented drivers. At the end of 2021 I got an EliteBook 845 g8 (Zen 3) that worked completely fine out of the box on Linux (Arch with up-to-date kernel). Every last bit of kit worked perfectly. Bluetooth, IR webcam, fingerprint…

In all my years I have yet to see HDMI output from a laptop to a monitor work on the first try in Ubuntu. Always need to install the proprietary drivers for that to work at all. If it can't even do that without a headache, after 10+ years of Linux use, I would call that a Linux problem, not a hardware problem. My colleagues seem to run into the same issue frequently as well. This article seems kind of ignorant. I'm g…

What Laptop is this? I never had an issue with the external outputs on any laptop I owned (and I've been running Linux since the 90s). I also don't know anyone who had these issues. The main issues I had were typically docking stations and suspend (but that has been super stable for my last 3 laptops).

Re: Linux on the laptop works so damn well that it’s boring

#219

Post by teawrecks »

londons_explore wrote: post #69

I have the reverse... Unless you have a thinkpad or some other popular hardware, you'll find Linux barely works at all out of the box, and even with hours of fiddling around, you'll still have to live without some features. For example, power saving features, sleep and hibernate, screen brightness controls, fingerprint readers, keyboard hotkeys and backlights, etc. rarely work. Prepare for broken external hdmi ports…

I've been running manjaro on a dell xps 15 2-in-1 without issue for about 3 or 4 years.

The only oddity is that it has the intel kbl-g gpu, so sometimes you have to manually choose which gpu to use if the app is badly behaving and you don't want it to suck your battery dry in an hour.

Re: Linux on the laptop works so damn well that it’s boring

#220

Post by nyanpasu64 »

mid-kid wrote: post #70

Yeah, no. Maybe with old laptops, but newer laptops still have their fair share of issues. When I bought my thinkpad A485 kernels wouldn't boot without additional parameters, the graphics would freeze at times and cause a hardlock, sleep and hibernation have been fixed and broken again intermittently over several kernel versions, the wifi card's AP mode started causing segfaults in kernel 5.2 due to the driver's rewr…

My Vostro 1400 (Core 2 Duo) has kernel bugs on sleep-wake related to the Ricoh xD media reader (remember those? I don't either), and my Inspiron 15R SE (Ivy Bridge) randomly disconnects from all external USB devices until I use the internal keyboard to remove and reload the xhci_hcd kernel module. And my Ideapad Flex 4 models have a bug where you can press Page Up, release Fn, and release Up, which on Windows stops sending Page Up events but on Linux results in a stuck Page Up key (technically a laptop bug but affects Linux far worse). So older laptops are by no means trouble-free either.
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