Earlier quoted context omitted.
A lot of programmers who are 35+ can struggle to find further opportunities as the more senior you are the less available those opportunities are and the more expensive you are. Lots of companies only want young people who are naive and have limited distractions outside of work. So, really, programming as a field is front loaded and the longer you stay in the business over 35 then the luckier you have been. But make…
I find the “I won’t take less than $X or else I’ll stay unemployed” to be kind of weird as a career planning strategy. If there is an under-supply of senior talent, everyone accepts and expects that the clearing salary for those roles will go up. Yet, if there’s an over-supply, many people seem unable to extrapolate from the previous.
Aging programmer
51–60 of 375 posts
Re: Aging programmer
#52I wonder where the genesis is of this idea that programming is young person's game akin to physical sports where speed, explosiveness and endurance matter. It seems to me that it's an intellectual activity where one should go on for very long honing their skills and becoming better and better at it with age. Maybe the industry sidelines the older more experienced technical folks at a cost, and that's why there seems…
Younger people with cognitive bias running the hiring shit show perhaps?
Re: Aging programmer
#53- Nope, I don't want spend my week doing 1:1 with a team.
- 40 years old and I was never so sharp as developer as now. Focused. Precise. Fearless.
- Being the most senior developer in my team, doesn't put me in any special position other than I deliver a lot of good code, I do a lot of devops tasks, i review a lot of PR and people hear me.
- I can scale my work through my peers.
- I trust and respect the managers and architects, because I understand how hard their job is.
- They trust and respect me because they know that I could do their work (and they mine) and the roles are not ranks, but choices.
I don't fear for my job. I know that in the worst case scenario, even earning 50% of my salary would be more than the average of the population and I would still have fun with that. I can work in a niche market like Java.. or hell even Cobol :)
Re: Aging programmer
#54I learned how to code when I was twelve. I wouldn't have if I didn't in some degree enjoy the actual act of coding, the moment to moment typing on the keyboard, composing algorithms, designing data structures and logical flows. But in the back of my mind I also always regarded coding as a means to an end. Sure I became engaged in language design battles, API design philosophy, but the magic with computers was always,…
During that time, I was a part time fitness instructor as a hobby, I trained for half marathons with friends, dabbled in real estate until around 2009 (guess how that worked out), got remarried, raised two (step) sons and now my wife and I are making plans to live a digital nomad life flying across the US. Our free time will be spent sightseeing and learning Spanish well enough to have a different experience when we stay in Mexico for a few weeks later this year.
Re: Aging programmer
#55I'm 47 years old, I'm a staff data engineer, and the fire in me to solve problems through programming is as strong as ever, and I expect it to last until I retire. I have zero interest in managing people, but I enjoy working with colleagues and teams to solve complex problems (through as simple solutions as possible). I learn something new everyday, and my hunger for learning is insatiable. Note: I get contacted by r…
Re: Aging programmer
#56Here’s something I think a lot of people don’t think on: 40 years old is mid-career. If you expect to retire at 60 (likely 65 these days) and you start working at 20: 40 is smack dab in the middle of your career. I think that notion gets lost when we talk about ageism in tech and then people talk about 40-somethings.
Several reasons for ageism sometimes missed. This from someone whose been discriminated against, who has hired, who now owns a company & who was also a recruiter.
__I don't agree with this__ just laying the reasons out for clarity sake:
- Hiring managers don't consider themselves ageist, but opt for younger employees whom they think make a better cultural fit. You can blame the 'work is my social life' culture that emerged in the 2000's and that persists today.
- Hiring managers don't want to be ageist, but they've had or heard of bad experiences where disgruntled or non-performing employees abuse the EEOC process for financial gain and retribution. Very well intentioned rules, designed to protect certain cohorts of employees, doing the exact opposite as is often the case with Gov regs.
- Hiring managers (usually fixated on 'new tech') who fear diminished learning, adoption or performance capacity in older employees.
- Money. The perception that older employees cost more in wages and benefits, without much thought to efficiency gains that accompanies gray hair.
I was age discriminated against by a well known SAAS provider, who used a 2014 interview process to extract a detailed roadmap and ideas for product growth from me, and then ghosted me. I've watched as they've (badly) implemented the specific of my roadmap the past few years, and I chuckle. 100% my fault for giving up too much value in the interview process, but it was tough time and I thought I really needed that job.
Re: Aging programmer
#57So large companies only?
Re: Aging programmer
#58Earlier quoted context omitted.
Younger people with cognitive bias running the hiring shit show perhaps?
Not only that but the younger are more maleable and gullible in some aspects but also have the better capacity (and willingness) to adapt to the tower of babel du jour.
Re: Aging programmer
#59Earlier quoted context omitted.
Hmmm as a 53 year old programmer I've had the exact opposite experience. Because of the large diversity of my skills I have more offers for work than ever before.
You’re the odd one out, perhaps due to your own abilities and other special qualities. For the average programmer ageism applies though. And the largest majority of devs is in the average region
Only an asshole cares how old somebody is. Reminder also, ageism isn't just a bummer, it's illegal.
Most people aren't going to take legal action, but imo if you're discriminated against you have somewhat of an obligation to do so.
Re: Aging programmer
#60Senior staff tend to get better at spotting the standard industry cons, but I find it amazing people often think they are somehow going to outsmart company contract/IP lawyers. Legal encumbrances are often a necessary evil, but some of the agreements fresh grads eagerly sign read like a Faustian bargain.
One finds many people tend to disbelieve anyone that contradicts their personal biases, and some get indignant when told how the churn-rate for large firms will affect them personally. It is like wishful thinking bypasses years of statistics training, and basic numeracy. Many industries simply rely or a steady stream of gullible STEM kids to keep their Youth Employment Tax credits, externalize training costs, and provide stock bumps from a symbolic layoff for year-end investor reports.
I wish the Tech industry treated people better, but "it is what it is". =)