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Ask HN: Strategies to land remote US job while living in living in EU?

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Re: Ask HN: Strategies to land remote US job while living in living in EU?

#21

Post by Semaphor »

sarchertech wrote: post #12

Many US companies hiring people from Europe are treating them as de facto employees but paying them as contractors. This is illegal. It’s not something that the US government has been regularly enforcing. But if the trend continues and ends up on the public’s radar, that will change.

It is probably doubly illegal. Not just in the US, but also in the country you live in. I don’t know for sure outside Germany, but I assume it’s similar: If you mainly live in Germany, you have to be hired according to German labor law (and pay taxes etc. in Germany)

Re: Ask HN: Strategies to land remote US job while living in living in EU?

#22

Post by Semaphor »

bitL wrote: post #20
sarchertech wrote: post #12

Many US companies hiring people from Europe are treating them as de facto employees but paying them as contractors. This is illegal. It’s not something that the US government has been regularly enforcing. But if the trend continues and ends up on the public’s radar, that will change.

It's not illegal. An EU person needs a legal entity in the EU (it can be either freelancer or a company) and then it's just usual B2B relationship where EU person pays their taxes, insurances etc. in the EU. US company still saves, i.e. instead of paying 200k to a fresh graduate they can pay it to a senior dev in the EU.

Depends, in Germany chances are that it falls under Scheinselbsttändigkeit (pseudo self-employment) which would be illegal.

Re: Ask HN: Strategies to land remote US job while living in living in EU?

#23

Post by pid-1 »

sarchertech wrote: post #17
scrollinondubs wrote: post #14

I worked previously for a US-based company that hired engineers from around the world (Pagely) and they didn't care where anyone worked. I don't have any specific advice other than these employers exist and you just have to find them. These are good sites with ability to filter down to remote-only: https://angel.co/jobs https://remoteok.com/ https://weworkremotely.com/ If you get pushback based on complexity it creat…

Most US companies will not deal with hiring someone as a direct employee from a country with the kind of worker protections most European countries have—unless they already have a presence there (and are likely paying local rates anyway).

Can't you start a company in the EU and get hired as a contractor to circumvent this?

That's the way to go for BR developers. You even get some cool tax breaks for exporting services.

Re: Ask HN: Strategies to land remote US job while living in living in EU?

#24

Post by meheleventyone »

bitL wrote: post #20
sarchertech wrote: post #12

Many US companies hiring people from Europe are treating them as de facto employees but paying them as contractors. This is illegal. It’s not something that the US government has been regularly enforcing. But if the trend continues and ends up on the public’s radar, that will change.

It's not illegal. An EU person needs a legal entity in the EU (it can be either freelancer or a company) and then it's just usual B2B relationship where EU person pays their taxes, insurances etc. in the EU. US company still saves, i.e. instead of paying 200k to a fresh graduate they can pay it to a senior dev in the EU.

The illegal bit isn’t the pay structure but the treatment of a contractor as an employee. Both the European and US laws make this distinction with similar criteria. This is to make sure companies aren’t avoiding their obligations to employees. And just from a moral perspective if you’re expecting someone to act like an employee you should treat them in kind.

Re: Ask HN: Strategies to land remote US job while living in living in EU?

#25

Post by cube2222 »

pid-1 wrote: post #23
sarchertech wrote: post #17

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Most US companies will not deal with hiring someone as a direct employee from a country with the kind of worker protections most European countries have—unless they already have a presence there (and are likely paying local rates anyway).

Can't you start a company in the EU and get hired as a contractor to circumvent this? That's the way to go for BR developers. You even get some cool tax breaks for exporting services.

Yes, that's the way you do it, at least in Poland.

You start a sole proprietorship and then just invoice your US-based client monthly.

It's very simple for both sides.

Re: Ask HN: Strategies to land remote US job while living in living in EU?

#26

Post by jacknews »

bitL wrote: post #16

TopTal, Crossover, Turing etc. Also: https://jobboardsearch.com/remote-jobs-only

Except with some of these you're giving up most of the 'wage arbitrage' to the 'agent' - they're often making as much as you are for every hour you work, sometimes even more, just for being an intermediary.

Re: Ask HN: Strategies to land remote US job while living in living in EU?

#27

Post by sarchertech »

bitL wrote: post #20
sarchertech wrote: post #12

Many US companies hiring people from Europe are treating them as de facto employees but paying them as contractors. This is illegal. It’s not something that the US government has been regularly enforcing. But if the trend continues and ends up on the public’s radar, that will change.

It's not illegal. An EU person needs a legal entity in the EU (it can be either freelancer or a company) and then it's just usual B2B relationship where EU person pays their taxes, insurances etc. in the EU. US company still saves, i.e. instead of paying 200k to a fresh graduate they can pay it to a senior dev in the EU.

Nope. Contracting through a legal entity doesn’t prevent you from being a defacto employee.

Re: Ask HN: Strategies to land remote US job while living in living in EU?

#28

Post by cube2222 »

bitL wrote: post #19
tok1 wrote: post #8

I don't want to sound negative but with current tax legislation in most EU countries, this is far more complicated than it may sound, at least to do it lawfully. Not impossible but in many cases, it requires a legal entity in your home country to be fully employed (i.e. not freelancer-based). I investigated a somewhat related scenario: Being employed at a German legal entity with an already-remote contract and reloca…

It's super easy actually. All one needs is to be a freelancer in the EU and use W-8BEN form in the US. No additional taxes, just EU ones.

Your invoices are also with 0% VAT (reverse charge), so arguably it's simpler than contracting for a European company.

Re: Ask HN: Strategies to land remote US job while living in living in EU?

#29

Post by woodson »

alanfranz wrote: post #18

I think you’re asking for a US salary rather than a US company in itself, right? Unless you’re an exceptional performer who can command a US salary from a position in EU, I think you could: - move to the US, maybe some remote area where cost of living is minimal but you get a reasonable internet connection - apply for a full remote job that accepts digital nomads, so they ack you could work from any timezone - go bac…

This would only work if you have work authorization in the US. All US employers must ensure proper completion of Form I-9 for each individual they hire for employment in the United States. (https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Form_I-9)

Re: Ask HN: Strategies to land remote US job while living in living in EU?

#30

Post by intelVISA »

shankr wrote: post #7
isbvhodnvemrwvn wrote: post #5

Earlier quoted context omitted.

99% of US companies with EU offices will NOT pay you anywhere close to the US level of money, IIRC the offer I received from Atlassian in Poland some years ago was not even competitive with the local market.

This! These American companies open their offices in order to cut costs. They aren't going to pay the same US salaries except outside of big tech.

Depends, if you're a known good quality they'll pay regardless of location (generally).
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