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Google loses EU appeal and is fined a record $4B

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Re: Google loses EU appeal and is fined a record $4B

#61

Post by p-e-w »

otippat wrote: post #52
p-e-w wrote: post #32

> This is Google's third EU antitrust fine. Previously, the search giant was fined in a shopping case and an online advertising case. Apparently, "three strikes and you're out" only applies to individuals, who with a repeat offense of this magnitude would have their lives destroyed by the justice system, and get locked away for a decade or more.

I don't think three-strikes laws exist anywhere other than in the US to be honest.

But whether it's a repeat offense is taken into account by almost every criminal justice system. A first-time thief might get off with a light sentence by claiming that they needed money and made a stupid mistake. That's not going to fly when it happens for the third time.

Re: Google loses EU appeal and is fined a record $4B

#62

Post by asddubs »

hemloc_io wrote: post #57
otippat wrote: post #52

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't think three-strikes laws exist anywhere other than in the US to be honest.

noone else is as beholden to baseball metaphors as us. There's even judges who love baseball so much they quote it in opinions lol.

when will the sport of baseball stop wreaking havoc on the justice system at last?

Re: Google loses EU appeal and is fined a record $4B

#63

Post by Hamcha »

Salgat wrote: post #49
nottorp wrote: post #38

> Android has created more choice for everyone, not less Did it? I can choose between an iOS phone and an Android phone. I may be able to choose from different manufacturers on the Android side, but on the software side there are just two options.

What they did with their manufacturers is a different issue, but in general they offer a lot more options than Apple. Android allows Manufacturers (such as Amazon and Samsung) to have their own app stores and allows for side loading apps, both of which are impossible with Apple.

You have it backward, Amazon and Samsung's own appstores are desperate attempts to get enough traction out of Play Store so that they are not forced to succumb to Google's demands. The issue here isn't Android not being open (which it is), the problem is Google having a lot of control (including full veto power) on devices shipping with Google Play Services, while making them an increasingly necessary part of Android. You can make an Android device without having to let Big G call the shots, but they're banking on you NOT doing that because no one wants a phone without the Play Store and its related services.

Re: Google loses EU appeal and is fined a record $4B

#65

Post by ocdtrekkie »

guitarbill wrote: post #59
BiteCode_dev wrote: post #50

Earlier quoted context omitted.

We really need the equivalent of jail time for companies. Clearly after a certain size, fines do not cut it. Jailing executives is too hard, so laws should exist that remove the company from a market for x years or something, like if they were in a cell.

> Jailing executives is too hard Do you mean "too difficult" or "too bigger punishment"? Either way, I disagree. If they reap the reward of huge salaries, they ought to take some of the risks.

Yup. And if you put Sundar Pichai and Mark Zuckerberg in jail for a year or two, watch the tech industry whip itself into shape in weeks. Hold people actually responsible for the damage they do and you'll see real change.

Re: Google loses EU appeal and is fined a record $4B

#66

Post by imiric »

nottorp wrote: post #38

> Android has created more choice for everyone, not less Did it? I can choose between an iOS phone and an Android phone. I may be able to choose from different manufacturers on the Android side, but on the software side there are just two options.

> I may be able to choose from different manufacturers on the Android side, but on the software side there are just two options.

What do you mean by "just two options"?

The AOSP ecosystem has a healthy range of ROMs to choose from on many devices. The process of installing alternative firmware may not be for everyone, but the choice is there, which is pretty much nonexistent for iOS devices.

Re: Google loses EU appeal and is fined a record $4B

#67

Post by dkarl »

davidguetta wrote: post #20
RandomWorker wrote: post #13

That increases the budget of the eu parliament with 2.2% on a yearly basis if paid out in one go. [1082B for 2014-2020, 4B/1082B*6y~2.2%] A loss of 4B is a decrease of revenue by 1.5% for google. [googles revenue was 256B in 2021 4/256~1.5%]

Quoted post unavailable.

If you're interested, there's a fascinating book called Life of a European Mandarin that provides an insider view and manages to be entertainingly written despite being about the incredibly dry work the EU does. It gives a vivid glimpse into how hard and tedious it is to accomplish things that are obvious wins like harmonizing trivial differences in laws across borders. You would expect it to be the kind of book you have to force yourself to finish, and there are certainly moments like that, but overall it reads more like a guilty pleasure, and I highly recommend it. It gave me respect for that kind of work and also makes me very glad I chose a different profession.

Re: Google loses EU appeal and is fined a record $4B

#68

Post by darkwater »

BiteCode_dev wrote: post #50
p-e-w wrote: post #32

> This is Google's third EU antitrust fine. Previously, the search giant was fined in a shopping case and an online advertising case. Apparently, "three strikes and you're out" only applies to individuals, who with a repeat offense of this magnitude would have their lives destroyed by the justice system, and get locked away for a decade or more.

We really need the equivalent of jail time for companies. Clearly after a certain size, fines do not cut it. Jailing executives is too hard, so laws should exist that remove the company from a market for x years or something, like if they were in a cell.

But this would hit on workers who might be really innocent/unaware, depending on their roles. If you go this way, then just jail current/past executives, it would be more fair.

Re: Google loses EU appeal and is fined a record $4B

#69

Post by KAMSPioneer »

AshamedCaptain wrote: post #45
PartiallyTyped wrote: post #41

Earlier quoted context omitted.

EU needs to do a better job at showing how useful it is, where the money goes and so on, so that people stop having this vague idea of what EU is and does, and start seeing the benefits. Should do a good job at reducing the number of eurosceptics.

Funny. I just heard literally the opposite complain a couple hours ago: that the EU advertisements are getting obnoxious. Virtually every single infrastructure project that is even partially financed by a EU agency shows all the appropriate logos almost everywhere.

Ha, I can see why; I work in an institute that receives funds from time to time for infrastructure enhancements and large projects. We have those logos scattered throughout some equipment, hanging in rooms, etc. It's far from intrusive, though. I would rather see a sign that says "EU helped pay for this" than product placement, if I'm being candid.

Re: Google loses EU appeal and is fined a record $4B

#70

Post by Normille »

Cool. The EU does have its [many!] faults. But they have a pretty good track record when it comes to consumer rights and consumer choice. Next up I'd like to see them do the same for the plethora of incompatible cordless power-tool systems out there as they did with insisting all mobile phones standardise on a USB connector.
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