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The Framework Laptop Chromebook Edition

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Re: The Framework Laptop Chromebook Edition

#221

Post by cbsmith »

dheera wrote: post #130
n0ric wrote: post #43

I'm having a hard time imagining the audience for this product. EDU most likely isn't going to go with this product due to cost (and can get easily complex, imagine trying to juggle all the expansion ports being lost by students), and typical audiences for ChromeOS devices don't always overlap with audiences who want easy repairability (and most likely are purchasing the device for the lack of nuances that other OSes…

Yeah exactly. $999 isn't exactly Chromebook territory.

I mean, HP's Elite DragonFly Chromebook is 50% more...

Re: The Framework Laptop Chromebook Edition

#222

Post by xorcist »

Arainach wrote: post #206
duped wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the question is, why ChromeOS instead of a Linux?

Biased opinion: I work on ChromeOS at Google Biased but informed opinion: I own a Framework Laptop running Ubuntu 22.04. Linux on a server or a desktop isn't so bad. Linux on a laptop is awful. Hibernation isn't supported. Battery life is mediocre, and battery drain in sleep is significant. If I close the lid on my Framework at 75% and come back the next day, it will be at 25%. If I come back in 3 days, it will be co…

> Even on a device designed to support Linux (Framework, Thinkpad, whatever)

There's apparently a world of difference. Nothing about the Framework suggests it was designed for Linux.

A proper Thinkpad does not have issues with hibernation, or losing battery, or graphics, or any of the other things you mentioned.

I just want something that works, and will receive updates as long as there are users. I don't want to muck about with VMs, or Crostini, or whatever it's called. Sounds like I must never let go of my Thinkpad.

Re: The Framework Laptop Chromebook Edition

#223

Post by JadeNB »

washadjeffmad wrote: post #122
n0ric wrote: post #43

I'm having a hard time imagining the audience for this product. EDU most likely isn't going to go with this product due to cost (and can get easily complex, imagine trying to juggle all the expansion ports being lost by students), and typical audiences for ChromeOS devices don't always overlap with audiences who want easy repairability (and most likely are purchasing the device for the lack of nuances that other OSes…

I'm on a $150 Chromebook from Costco right now because it has a really nice display for text, it gets 8 hours of battery life at full brightness, and there's nothing I do that I can't do on another computer, somewhere else. And somehow, this thing got my attention. I don't have any interest in their traditional PC laptop line, but I've been waffling over buying a Pixelbook for years because dealing with Google Suppor…

> there's nothing I do that I can't do on another computer, somewhere else.

Is that a misplaced "can't"? (Something like "there's nothing I can't do that I can do on another computer, somewhere else"?)

Re: The Framework Laptop Chromebook Edition

#224

Post by kiawe_fire »

hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #68

This is awesome! I still use my Pixelbook, and I love it, and was always dismayed that it seemed to be yet another great product that Google lost interest in. For folks wondering "who's the market in this?", the Linux container support in ChromeOS is awesome - my Pixelbook was actually a great dev laptop (I ran postgres, VSCode, Node, etc on it), just with age it's lack of upgrades is starting to show. So for me, on…

This is actually the first I’m hearing of Chrome OS supporting Linux apps out of the box.

I always dismissed Chrome OS as a glorified iPad or Android tablet with a keyboard and desktop.

I’m mostly happy with my Linux-based HP dev one, but this is causing me to seriously consider a Chromebook (like this Framework variant) next upgrade.

Re: The Framework Laptop Chromebook Edition

#225

Post by dheera »

IE6 wrote: post #220
dheera wrote: post #130

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Yeah exactly. $999 isn't exactly Chromebook territory.

Chromebook ecosystem is completely saturated with low end / low cost devices so there is not a segment of the market there that is not being met. Even the "high end" devices are often computationally anemic (Pixelbook series with Y series CPUs and eMMC drives). As a Chromebook user I am glad there are at least 2 high end options now (Framework and HP Elite Dragonfly).

Why would people pay that much for a Chromebook, when you could just install Ubuntu and delete all the icons except for Chrome?

Re: The Framework Laptop Chromebook Edition

#226

Post by r2binx »

duped wrote: post #202
yjftsjthsd-h wrote: post #194

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The usual reason for a lot of those boil down to "poor driver support", but this is the same hardware with what I would presume is the same Linux kernel so same drivers, so what's the difference?

The usual reason is that you can't enable hibernate with disk encryption

You definitely can. Actually relatively simple if you know your way around Linux. This is a good guide for Arch [1]. I think there's a couple more steps on Fedora or if you're using zram in general but it's definitely doable. I've even got it working with secure boot using my own keys.

[1]: https://gist.github.com/RobFisher/abd9b2b9fca4194ac8df112715...

Re: The Framework Laptop Chromebook Edition

#227

Post by caskstrength »

Arainach wrote: post #206
duped wrote: post #83

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the question is, why ChromeOS instead of a Linux?

Biased opinion: I work on ChromeOS at Google Biased but informed opinion: I own a Framework Laptop running Ubuntu 22.04. Linux on a server or a desktop isn't so bad. Linux on a laptop is awful. Hibernation isn't supported. Battery life is mediocre, and battery drain in sleep is significant. If I close the lid on my Framework at 75% and come back the next day, it will be at 25%. If I come back in 3 days, it will be co…

Sounds more like a list of problems with Framework. Battery life on my x1c is similar to Windows (TLP FTW!) and with working S3 (what Lenovo calls "Sleep mode: Linux" in their BIOS) battery drain during sleep is very low. Can't say anything about quality of Bluetooth stack though since I don't use it.

Re: The Framework Laptop Chromebook Edition

#228

Post by xd1936 »

turtlebits wrote: post #211
kyrra wrote: post #126

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I think the hard thing here is that they want to keep the Linux VMs totally isolated from ChromeOS itself, so that they aren't opening up users to attacks. This is taking a lot of effort to get right. I will say, the Pixelbook was super underpowered. They use the ultra-portable Intel CPUs that have a TDP of 7W, which makes them super slow with anything CPU intensive. The Dragonfly chrombook has a 15W base power usage…

You might be thinking of the Pixelbook Go with the Intel m3? My Pixelbook (from 2018) is an i5, and performs fine.

They're right. I loved my Pixelbook (non-Go), but the Core i5[1] and i7[2] used pretty underpowered 7W CPUs.

1. https://www.intel.com/content/www/us/en/products/sku/97461/i...

2. https://ark.intel.com/content/www/us/en/ark/products/95441/i...

Re: The Framework Laptop Chromebook Edition

#229

Post by hollerith »

duped wrote: post #83
hn_throwaway_99 wrote: post #68

This is awesome! I still use my Pixelbook, and I love it, and was always dismayed that it seemed to be yet another great product that Google lost interest in. For folks wondering "who's the market in this?", the Linux container support in ChromeOS is awesome - my Pixelbook was actually a great dev laptop (I ran postgres, VSCode, Node, etc on it), just with age it's lack of upgrades is starting to show. So for me, on…

I think the question is, why ChromeOS instead of a Linux?

ChromeOS (especially when "pre-installed", as is the case here) is much more secure than Linux, IMO.
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