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Magnus Carlsen resigns against Hans Niemann after one move

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31–40 of 338 posts

Re: Magnus Carlsen resigns against Hans Niemann after one move

#31

Kind of a basic question but how do you cheat at chess, especially "over the board" ?

I recommend to check out this story that came up recently

Cheating at chess with a computer for my shoes: https://news.ycombinator.com/item?id=32729105

Re: Magnus Carlsen resigns against Hans Niemann after one move

#32
I love what Magnus is doing. Of course can't accuse Hans of cheating, because AlphaZero works much more similar to humans than alpha-beta search.

The article shows the amount of pressure tournament organizers are putting on him, but nowdays the money is in streaming more than in tournaments.

Re: Magnus Carlsen resigns against Hans Niemann after one move

#33
post #2

For context, Magnus withdrew from a major tournament last month after losing to Hans. He has not made a statement, but it is understood that he suspects Hans of cheating. Hans has admitted to cheating online, though he denies cheating in person. As more evidence comes out, it seems that Hans has cheated a lot more than he admitted, and potentially over the board as well (for example, this analysis [1] shows that he's…

> As more evidence comes out I haven't seen evidence of Neumann's cheating, as is claimed in this comment. Only allegations, which do not look very strong to me.

There are two lines of evidence: first regarding his cheating online, which is easier to do and easier to check. Chess.com banned Hans and put out a statement saying that Hans cheated more often and more seriously than he claimed. [1]

The second line of inquiry is statistical analyses of Hans's over-the-board games. See my original comment for one such analysis, but he really has been playing at an absurd level in some games (performing as well 0 centipawn loss against some engines!)

It's not a good look.

[1] https://twitter.com/chesscom/status/1568010971616100352

Re: Magnus Carlsen resigns against Hans Niemann after one move

#34

Kind of a basic question but how do you cheat at chess, especially "over the board" ?

at very high level you don't need a lot to turn the tables. a sign of when to act agressive/defensive could be enough. I can think of millions ways to give this sign.

Re: Magnus Carlsen resigns against Hans Niemann after one move

#35

Kind of a basic question but how do you cheat at chess, especially "over the board" ?

With a computer. A simple way is to have a chess game on your machine playing at the most difficult setting. You enter your opponent's move, the computer plays a move in response which you then replicate in the game against your opponent.

Got it. Makes sense. Kinda sad.

Re: Magnus Carlsen resigns against Hans Niemann after one move

#36
post #4
post #2

For context, Magnus withdrew from a major tournament last month after losing to Hans. He has not made a statement, but it is understood that he suspects Hans of cheating. Hans has admitted to cheating online, though he denies cheating in person. As more evidence comes out, it seems that Hans has cheated a lot more than he admitted, and potentially over the board as well (for example, this analysis [1] shows that he's…

As someone who’s never been able to appreciate or follow sports where a machine can be an order of magnitude better than a human, I would genuinely like to understand why people are enamored about such sports. In the end it seems like brilliant minds lost in math that’s not even novel anymore.. again everyone should do what they please, but this is just an academic question from someone unable to appreciate such skil…

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Re: Magnus Carlsen resigns against Hans Niemann after one move

#37
post #2

For context, Magnus withdrew from a major tournament last month after losing to Hans. He has not made a statement, but it is understood that he suspects Hans of cheating. Hans has admitted to cheating online, though he denies cheating in person. As more evidence comes out, it seems that Hans has cheated a lot more than he admitted, and potentially over the board as well (for example, this analysis [1] shows that he's…

> As more evidence comes out I haven't seen evidence of Neumann's cheating, as is claimed in this comment. Only allegations, which do not look very strong to me.

I have heard a concrete allegation that in the Capablanca Memorial 2022 tournament (which was over the board), Niemann has games where he plays normally up to a point in the midgame, then he plays the top line of a specific engine (Stockfish 11) for an implausible number of moves in sequence.

There are a lot of lower-quality accusations, but this is the interesting one IMO. It should be easy enough to independently check for someone who has a setup for that sort of thing.

Re: Magnus Carlsen resigns against Hans Niemann after one move

#38

Kind of a basic question but how do you cheat at chess, especially "over the board" ?

There are many ways. You need outside help for everything though - you need someone to input the current board state into some kind of chess engine, and then relay the best possible move back to you somehow. There have been cases where someone has hidden a phone in the bathrooms to use for either communicating or inputting into a chess engine themselves. In Niemanns case people have joked about vibrating anal beads c…

The shoe insert has actually been built, though I haven't heard if it, or something similar, has been used in real cheating yet.

It's a shoe-to-Pi device called Sockfish (a pun on the Stockfish chess engine): https://incoherency.co.uk/blog/stories/sockfish.html

Re: Magnus Carlsen resigns against Hans Niemann after one move

#40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t understand why people are going out their way to justify Carlsen attitude. What we have is the world champion throwing a tantrum because he lost against a player there is absolutely no evidence has cheated against him and is now calling for him to be expelled despite having no evidence whatsoever. This is harassment pure and simple. The whole thing is disgraceful and reflects extremely badly on competitive ch…

>is now calling for him to be expelled He made no comment.

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