My income has definitely not been stagnant for the past decade, but I'm a freelancer. Last year I briefly was an employee, and I was appalled at what that meant for my income. It was not $120k-$160k, it was more like €70k.
Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?
221–230 of 345 posts
Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?
#222Earlier quoted context omitted.
Graduates in London should be starting on £80K now. After putting some contributions away for retirement that "decent senior" on £80K might just about be able to buy a 1-2 bed flat in a soulless development in an "OK" part of London, but definitely not a family home. A graduate? Min 10% in to a pension (if aged 20), student loan, and they're only taking home £3.8K/mo. £2K/mo for rent is easily spent on a 1 bed furnis…
Yes, the cost of living is extremely high, and you haven't considered the cost of childcare, school and healthcare (the NHS has never been great, but it went AWOL since the lockdowns). In London either you make in excess of 150K or you’d be better off working as a janitor in a random continental European country. Add 50K for each dependant. And I’m not sure it’s worth moving to London with a 200K salary if you don’t…
Slightly exaggerated, but I agree with the sentiment.
Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?
#223Earlier quoted context omitted.
The railroads in the US are close to striking because they only get 1 random day off per month. 353/365 days working. Yea, I'll take the occasional phone call at 1 AM for a production down over that.
"Rail employees are provided with significant time off. Generally, train crew employees have over three to four weeks of paid vacation and over 10 personal leave days. Depending on craft and seniority, these numbers can extend to five weeks of vacation in addition to 14 paid holidays and/or paid leave days,” BNSF told CNBC. “The number of Personal Leave Days was increased by 25% this year which makes it easier for em…
"A crucial issue in the dispute is a points-based attendance policy adopted by some of the largest carriers earlier this year. Those policies penalize workers, up to termination, for going to routine doctor’s visits or attending to family emergencies. Conductors and engineers say that they can be on call for 14 consecutive days without a break and that they do not receive a single sick day, paid or unpaid.
“All we’re asking is folks to be able to go to routine doctor’s visits without pay, but they have refused to accept our proposals,” Dennis Pierce, president of the Brotherhood of Locomotive Engineers and Trainmen (BLET) said before the deal was struck. “The average American would not know that we get fired for going to the doctor. This one thing has our members most enraged. We have guys who were punished for taking time off for a heart attack and covid. It’s inhumane.”"
Yes go be that instead of a SWE.
Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?
#224I know it's an unpopular opinion around here, but it's worth considering if forming tech unions could help. Tech companies are making huge profits per employee but holding wages down.
We can build unions based on our democratic interests - what do we care about? Salary, benefits, paid oncall, IP restrictions, open source, etc.
We don't have to sign up with one of the giant calcified corrupt US unions, there are plenty of shops out there that are more modern and give local groups much more autonomy.
Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?
#225Going anon for this I grew up poor, got in trouble with the law at 18 - but was coding since I was 9, now I have been writing software for 20+ years professionally, no degree, and have never been able to clear more than 250k - moved from coding to mgmt but still cant break 250. I looked at changing companies to a FAANG but haven’t been able to dedicate the massive amount of time needed to prep for the algo whiteboard…
Swallow the leetcode prep slowly over time, and then FAANG. Play the startup lottery (potentially high equity that will pay off in 5-10y). Try a hedge fund (high base). Move up the management ladder. Side gig product or sell a course on something you have unique expertise in. Move to Philly!
I'm moving to PA, so out of curiosity, why are you recommending to move to Philly?
Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?
#226I know it's an unpopular opinion around here, but it's worth considering if forming tech unions could help. Tech companies are making huge profits per employee but holding wages down. We can build unions based on our democratic interests - what do we care about? Salary, benefits, paid oncall, IP restrictions, open source, etc. We don't have to sign up with one of the giant calcified corrupt US unions, there are plent…
Unions are popular in fields like construction, medicine, teaching, etc because of:
1. The field otherwise would be chronically underpaid
2. The field is dangerous, or has a history of encouraging dangerous behavior
3. The field makes moving between jobs quickly hard
4. The field is antiquated, and the union is essentially a protection racket for prior skilled workers (this is very common in "older" fields).
Programming is none of these. Wages may be stagnating at the FAANGs but they certainly aren't anywhere else. My own experience with unions has me leary. In exchange for protection you mentioned we get:
1. Pitiful raises because they are no longer based on merit but "representation"
2. possibly better benefits
3. possibly better on call.
Given if I don't like a company I can mark "looking for work" on linkedin and get 30+ job offers in a week I see no purpose. The looking for work button is your union. Literally, just get a new job. Tech companies may enjoy the idea of a union. You end up getting journeyman programmers and often times they will be for less than what a merit rate would give. The key here is merit. A driver of our field. Since raises are given to everyone they are smaller. Those 30k+ pay bumps you get switching jobs? Gone. Busting your ass for a 10k raise at the end of the year because you merit it? Gone. Taking classes at the university? Gone, most college union work programs require you to join a union to even take the class. For what? Even "underpaid" programmers make 2x the average salary of almost any other field. You're going to have to convince people making 100k+ in a country where the average family makes 60k that they should unionize "for their own protection". It will never happen.
Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?
#227Going anon for this I grew up poor, got in trouble with the law at 18 - but was coding since I was 9, now I have been writing software for 20+ years professionally, no degree, and have never been able to clear more than 250k - moved from coding to mgmt but still cant break 250. I looked at changing companies to a FAANG but haven’t been able to dedicate the massive amount of time needed to prep for the algo whiteboard…
90% of NYC IT dept lives in Jersey. 150k is enough for a family to live on. Get on the train at 6am like the rest of us. :)
Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?
#228Going anon for this I grew up poor, got in trouble with the law at 18 - but was coding since I was 9, now I have been writing software for 20+ years professionally, no degree, and have never been able to clear more than 250k - moved from coding to mgmt but still cant break 250. I looked at changing companies to a FAANG but haven’t been able to dedicate the massive amount of time needed to prep for the algo whiteboard…
If you can't afford an apartment on 250K you need to take a serious look at your spending and figure out what you actually want to prioritize. Sure, you won't be picking up a $3M apartment overlooking Central Park, but toooooons of Brooklyn and Queens should be affordable to you with that level of income. I got a mortgage a few years ago when I was only pulling down $180K and I was approved for up to $1MM loan, most…
I don't think this person is claiming to make 250k. They probably used that as a reference figure because the root post uses that as a reference point.
Most likely this person makes a more median tech salary in the mid 100s.
Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?
#229Going anon for this I grew up poor, got in trouble with the law at 18 - but was coding since I was 9, now I have been writing software for 20+ years professionally, no degree, and have never been able to clear more than 250k - moved from coding to mgmt but still cant break 250. I looked at changing companies to a FAANG but haven’t been able to dedicate the massive amount of time needed to prep for the algo whiteboard…
They probably have a rich, well connected daddy. For normal people, $250k is probably as high as you can possibly go. I also have experience with distributed systems, worked 80 hours a week for 10 years straight and built several popular open source projects and I can't get past $80k... Almost feels like a conspiracy against me at this stage but I suspect it just comes down to not having a rich daddy who is connected…
It honestly seems like you have an attitude problem.
Re: Ask HN: Have tech salaries been stagnant for the past decade?
#230I know it's an unpopular opinion around here, but it's worth considering if forming tech unions could help. Tech companies are making huge profits per employee but holding wages down. We can build unions based on our democratic interests - what do we care about? Salary, benefits, paid oncall, IP restrictions, open source, etc. We don't have to sign up with one of the giant calcified corrupt US unions, there are plent…
Unions are popular in fields like construction, medicine, teaching, etc because of: 1. The field otherwise would be chronically underpaid 2. The field is dangerous, or has a history of encouraging dangerous behavior 3. The field makes moving between jobs quickly hard 4. The field is antiquated, and the union is essentially a protection racket for prior skilled workers (this is very common in "older" fields). Programm…
>Unions are popular in fields like construction, medicine, teaching, etc because of:
1. The field otherwise would be chronically underpaid
what world are you living in where these are considered fairly compensated?