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Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

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Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#461

Post by systemvoltage »

NonNefarious wrote: post #449
austinjp wrote: post #327

The UK media (not just the BBC) continue to profess "amazement" at the speed and efficiency of the transitioning from a dead monarch to a living one. There's been much speaking in awed tones at the pace of the various proclamations, committee meetings, document signings, etc, as if this pace tells us why we should be impressed. Personally I've found it borderline sickening. If there was a curtain that could have slip…

Quoted post unavailable.

Criticism of monarchy spreads around with remarkable petulance. When I watch the ceromonies and rituals, I just see it like a cosplay event; if I am completely honest. But that doesn't mean that my new found 'revelation' needs to be weaponized to gain internet points.

I just find it immature. I've got better things to do that either praise or disdainfully scorn at the monarchy. Exactly, who cares! On internet points, ufff... I see the irony already.

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#462

Post by tablespoon »

brainfish wrote: post #444
mrcsd wrote: post #429

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Of course I agree that there is no written constitution, I said as much above. But there _is_ a constitution. Constitutions do not have to be written, unless you think otherwise?

If there's just one British constitution and everyone agrees on it, then it seems like writing it down would be pretty trivial.

> If there's just one British constitution and everyone agrees on it, then it seems like writing it down would be pretty trivial.

Honestly, a country can have a universally recognized and respected written constitution without "everyone agree[ing] on it." See United States of America, Constitution Of.

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#463

Post by WastingMyTime89 »

tialaramex wrote: post #268
WastingMyTime89 wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it going to be one of this discussion where people speak of Cromwell while pretending the USA and France don’t exist? Just asking.

The USA is the one where they give their elected figurehead pardon powers - like a King in the old times - and the previous one used them to insulate friends who very obviously did crimes. Then in fact he promises to do the same again only more so if given the chance, but his political allies protect him from prosecution anyway. Wow. I mean, I guess Cromwell was worse, but it's not exactly an enviable choice. The US…

> France's setup is better, but if there had been some way to not execute the King of France I think they'd be doing just fine with some guy in a fancy hat living in one of their palaces and somebody to represent France as an idea who isn't connected to a political executive.

France deposed its last two kings and its last emperor without executing them so I think we can safely assume than no actually no one wants a king there.

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#464

Post by bee_rider »

tialaramex wrote: post #268
WastingMyTime89 wrote: post #193

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Is it going to be one of this discussion where people speak of Cromwell while pretending the USA and France don’t exist? Just asking.

The USA is the one where they give their elected figurehead pardon powers - like a King in the old times - and the previous one used them to insulate friends who very obviously did crimes. Then in fact he promises to do the same again only more so if given the chance, but his political allies protect him from prosecution anyway. Wow. I mean, I guess Cromwell was worse, but it's not exactly an enviable choice. The US…

It is hard to say if the US form of government is really less stable than any other democracy -- since the US has been around, many countries have undergone wild changes to the structure of their governments. The US system has changed as well, it is an ever-evolving process.

Not sure the US is crumbling, there are some alarming elements but then we've always had our fair share of dummies over here. Somehow we've stumbled our way into a pretty powerful position, but of course as the UK can attest, global power can evaporate quite quickly. Hypothetically, if we undergo a Rome style transition from representative government to empire, does that count as stable?

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#465

Post by krisoft »

robomartin wrote: post #390
austinjp wrote: post #327

The UK media (not just the BBC) continue to profess "amazement" at the speed and efficiency of the transitioning from a dead monarch to a living one. There's been much speaking in awed tones at the pace of the various proclamations, committee meetings, document signings, etc, as if this pace tells us why we should be impressed. Personally I've found it borderline sickening. If there was a curtain that could have slip…

One thing I will never understand about people who pretty much hate where they live for one reason or another: Why don't they leave? Seriously. I am not taking sides here. I have visited the UK as a tourist and on business a zillion times over the last four decades. And yet, I am not qualified to voice opinion as to the realities of living there. From the outside, as someone visiting from the US, for lack of a better…

> One thing I will never understand about people who pretty much hate where they live for one reason or another: Why don't they leave?

Hate is a very strong word. What about people who love the place they live in, but have a few things which they would like to chane?

It is perfectly conceivable that someone would love their life in the UK yet thinks that there should be no exceptions written into the law about the business of a particular family.

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#466

Post by dijit »

klipklop wrote: post #248
matthewh806 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see this exact same comment did pretty well on Reddit too: https://www.reddit.com/r/unitedkingdom/comments/xckw5v/comme... 1. Not all of the arrests have been made at a "funeral" 2. It wasn't a funeral 3. If you're going to have a very public precession, parading a body through the streets with all the obedients lapping it up, surely you have to have a level of tolerance for dissenting voices? I imagine the disrupt…

Creepy that this is copypasta'ed in multiple places and is a highly upvoted comment...

I copied and pasted it because it articulated what I wanted to say but was crafted better than I could have said it. Likely I should have attributed it to the source (Reddit) but it was spur of the moment on a thread with 5 comments and 3 votes. Alas.

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#467

Post by tablespoon »

haltingproblem wrote: post #419
noahtallen wrote: post #380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know much about UK law, but it is at least is constitutional monarchy. So the ruler and rituals of succession exist under the purview of the people and parliament. Surely there is just not enough political will to change it. That’s very different from your implication that it’s some kind of authoritarian hellscape. Rewording: this “keeps happening” because it’s written into the constitution of the UK. If it d…

There is no constitution. How can it be a constitutional monarchy? Before anyone points out that it is an unwritten constitution, please exchange my invisible benjies for some gold.

> There is no constitution. How can it be a constitutional monarchy? Before anyone points out that it is an unwritten constitution, please exchange my invisible benjies for some gold.

You misunderstand what a constitution is. It's not a document, which is an inanimate thing that cannot actually do anything. Rather, it's a set of customs and principles that are respected and followed. The latter is what actually matters, the UK has it, and it takes precedence over any written document (e.g. the constitution of North Korea "guarantees" free speech rights, but the customs and principles of the North Korean government voids that).

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#468

Post by arbitrary_name »

gerdesj wrote: post #344
HL33tibCe7 wrote: post #292

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It was a terrible tragedy, but it’s patently absurd that we should give someone a jail sentence for making a joke about it. (The jail sentence was suspended, but that’s hardly the point. Any criminal conviction, even a fine, carries the ultimate threat of jail, or, if you resist arrest, even death — all this, for a joke).

Are you sure you condone joking about the deaths of people in Grenfell Tower? I've lived on these shores (South Somerset) for 52 years now and I have made the most awful jokes about some things as anyone probably has here. However, there is a point beyond which I won't go - causing deliberate hurt. I don't know about the particular case that you refer to or actually skirt around - citation needed please. A joke does…

I don't condone the actions, but a jail sentence is utterly absurd and is, frankly, very unsettling. Why should insulting people be a jailable offense? There wouldn't be a stand up comedian left walking free if we consistently enforced this.

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#469

Post by apengwin »

makeitdouble wrote: post #387
quadrifoliate wrote: post #278

Earlier quoted context omitted.

As an American, it is hard for me to properly grasp the fact that the UK almost seems closer to Saudi Arabia than the US in this regard. It does not seem like having a "fuck imperialism" sign should ever get you arrested in a country that is supposedly one of the closest allies of the US.

I'm kinda puzzled. I know the US is wide and there's many pockets of everything, but in so many ways the US seems more religious and actively putting it into laws than the UK. Digging far away, only the US tried to ban alcohol consumption, an angle only islamic countries are also interested in as far as I know. Looking back only a few weeks ago, abortion protection has been abolished nation wide. To only take super s…

The US does have wide protections for really really objectionable speech still. See snyder v phelps

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#470

Post by elihu »

random_upvoter wrote: post #214

I've been a bit disconcerted at the level of unmitigated adulation that's been showered on the late queen by the media. I have nothing bad to say about Elizabeth II but I too do my job every day -- without a staff of hundreds to prepare my breakfast -- and I don't think I will be sanctified the day I keel over. It's all so serious and deeply conservative you'd think we are back in the 1950. In the 1970s Monty Python…

As an American I find it a little weird that Biden ordered flags at half staff until the queen's funeral is over -- 11 days in total I think. I mean she is the queen, and she has been the queen since before most of us, and some of our parents, were born, but she isn't /our/ queen.

I guess it's not that unusual though to lower the flag for a few days on the death of a foreign leader. Apparently we went 3 days for Shinzo Abe. Nothing for Gorbachev, though. (Maybe it would have been worth it just to annoy Putin.) Not sure when the last time was we went 11 days or more for a non-US figure.

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