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Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

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Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#391

Post by opportune »

alphaddx wrote: post #350
austinjp wrote: post #327

The UK media (not just the BBC) continue to profess "amazement" at the speed and efficiency of the transitioning from a dead monarch to a living one. There's been much speaking in awed tones at the pace of the various proclamations, committee meetings, document signings, etc, as if this pace tells us why we should be impressed. Personally I've found it borderline sickening. If there was a curtain that could have slip…

I'm genuinely interested to know what you think should happen after a monarch passes. This has been the process for over 1000 years and while we have a constitutional monarchy this is what happens. I'm actually not in favour of a monarchy myself but I don't get how people would be surprised at what's currently happening.

That person may be from a culture with no monarchy. As an American I find the whole process and institution disgusting (yes, before you type out a clever reply, I know we have our own problems and I also probably find those disgusting). So many resources dedicated to one family with no real functional role and not even a veneer of merit…

I think part of it is that culturally the British monarchy is the most relevant in the English speaking world, so it’s just considered a bigger deal than if the Swedish monarch died. It gets TV time even in other countries. But yes, it does also expose a huge amount of excess and brings to light a lot of lesser known aspects of the monarchy.

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#393

Post by cpleppert »

chasil wrote: post #365
stjohnswarts wrote: post #345

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don't get this, it's not like the king of england has any real power. I know it's a waste of tax money but the US governments wastes tax money all day long too, as do all governments on pork projects and subsidies.

Au contraire. https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2021/feb/09/queens-conse... https://www.theguardian.com/commentisfree/2021/feb/08/queen-... "Queen’s consent is a procedural rule, internal to the workings of parliament and of unclear origins, which requires the monarch’s consent to be obtained for certain types of legislation – before they can be presented for final approval by either house of parliament." Also note…

Kings/Queens consent is for legislation affecting the royal household. Parliament is not bound by the monarch's consent in any case.

Every appointed member of the house of lords and the supreme court is appointed on the advice of the prime minister and cabinet.

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#394

Post by 13of40 »

stjohnswarts wrote: post #345
austinjp wrote: post #327

The UK media (not just the BBC) continue to profess "amazement" at the speed and efficiency of the transitioning from a dead monarch to a living one. There's been much speaking in awed tones at the pace of the various proclamations, committee meetings, document signings, etc, as if this pace tells us why we should be impressed. Personally I've found it borderline sickening. If there was a curtain that could have slip…

I don't get this, it's not like the king of england has any real power. I know it's a waste of tax money but the US governments wastes tax money all day long too, as do all governments on pork projects and subsidies.

The king of England can't be arrested or sued, so that puts a huge amount of asymmetry into this situation. You get arrested for shouting during his parade, but he could (and please anyone, correct me if I'm wrong) shoot you in Trafalgar Square and get away with it.

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#395

Post by opportune »

quibono wrote: post #383
xani_ wrote: post #371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole monarch clowfest does bring tourism in so it might be not complete waste of tax money

I've heard that many times but I've always wondered whether is is a net positive given all the tax spending that goes towards the royal family. I guess we'll never know since it's impossible to tell exactly how much tourism is in part based on the queen/king/monarchy sentiment.

It ignores the fact that the royal family owns a tremendous amount of assets that are not directly used in tourism or used by the state. And that they live off those taxes and spending.

If the UK abolished the monarchy, tourism attractions like Westminster and the Crown Jewels would still exist

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#396

Post by ravel-bar-foo »

Somatochlora wrote: post #370
alphaddx wrote: post #350

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I'm genuinely interested to know what you think should happen after a monarch passes. This has been the process for over 1000 years and while we have a constitutional monarchy this is what happens. I'm actually not in favour of a monarchy myself but I don't get how people would be surprised at what's currently happening.

There's nothing about having a monarch as the head of state that requires so much ceremony and attention. We could stop putting the king on currency, not have official periods of mourning, relegate news about the royal to the tabloids etc. without making any changes to how the government is structured.

Realistically speaking, if it weren't the monarchs wasting tabeloid inches it would be the equally inane antics of Hollywood celebrities. It's good for the UK to have homegrown entertainment, and nice that it has a historical foundation, rather than the vapidness that is lowbrow entertainment elsewhere.

Note that for the royal family, the ceremony and waste of resources is the point. The UK monarchs have generational wealth, but more power from celebrity than from law. The pomp, theatrics, ritual, and press keeps them relevant to the public. In return, they maintain the history and legacy of the UK: palaces, museums, and castles are maintained on the royal purse, but often open for tours to the public.

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#398

Post by toomanybeersies »

quibono wrote: post #383
xani_ wrote: post #371

Earlier quoted context omitted.

The whole monarch clowfest does bring tourism in so it might be not complete waste of tax money

I've heard that many times but I've always wondered whether is is a net positive given all the tax spending that goes towards the royal family. I guess we'll never know since it's impossible to tell exactly how much tourism is in part based on the queen/king/monarchy sentiment.

The king is paid from earnings generated by the Crown Estate [0], which is basically a state owned property investment fund. From my understanding, taxpayer money hasn't been used to fund the monarchy since the 1700s.

[0] https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Crown_Estate

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#399

Post by mrcsd »

lern_too_spel wrote: post #388
noahtallen wrote: post #380

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I don’t know much about UK law, but it is at least is constitutional monarchy. So the ruler and rituals of succession exist under the purview of the people and parliament. Surely there is just not enough political will to change it. That’s very different from your implication that it’s some kind of authoritarian hellscape. Rewording: this “keeps happening” because it’s written into the constitution of the UK. If it d…

It isn't even allowed to come to a vote. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/King%27s_Consent

That's not correct, crown consent cannot stop a vote. And regardless of this, parliament is sovereign [0], that supremacy overrides any power any monarch could have in the UK.

[0]: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Parliamentary_sovereignty

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#400

Post by toomanybeersies »

opportune wrote: post #395
quibono wrote: post #383

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I've heard that many times but I've always wondered whether is is a net positive given all the tax spending that goes towards the royal family. I guess we'll never know since it's impossible to tell exactly how much tourism is in part based on the queen/king/monarchy sentiment.

It ignores the fact that the royal family owns a tremendous amount of assets that are not directly used in tourism or used by the state. And that they live off those taxes and spending. If the UK abolished the monarchy, tourism attractions like Westminster and the Crown Jewels would still exist

Imagine the money they'd make if they turned Buckingham Palace into a hotel.
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