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Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

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Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#291

Post by IncRnd »

User23 wrote: post #202
matthewh806 wrote: post #184

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I would say both; you can oppose the procession itself for all of its pomp and archaic tradition at a time where the country is dealing with a cost of living crisis and also have that also be more broadly a protest against the monarchy in general. A large portion of the life of the royal family is public, even funded by the taxpayer, so to me it makes sense to allow for opposing viewpoints to be heard. Perhaps you ca…

That’s not how money works in the UK. The taxpayer isn’t funding the monarchy or anything else. If anything the Crown is funding the taxpayer via the Bank of England. Edit: evidently people are confused. Here it is from the horse’s mouth: https://www.bankofengland.co.uk/quarterly-bulletin/2014/q1/m...

Except the Royals themselves say something else. You linked to a webpage about how money gets created which isn't germane to the provenance of the already existing money that is owned by the royal family.

Take a look at "the official web site of the British Royal Family. Written and managed by the Royal Household at Buckingham Palace, the site aims to provide an authoritative resource of information about the Monarchy and Royal Family, past and present." [1]

That website has a webpage devoted to the "Royal Finances" [2] that says, "There are three sources of funding for The Queen, or officials of the Royal Household acting on Her Majesty’s behalf, in both a public and private capacity. These are: the Sovereign Grant, the Privy Purse and The Queen’s personal wealth and income."

"The Sovereign Grant: This is the amount of money provided by Government to the Royal Household in support of The Queen’s official duties, including the maintenance of the Occupied Royal Palaces: Buckingham Palace, St James’s Palace, Clarence House, Marlborough House Mews, the residential and office areas of Kensington Palace, Windsor Castle and the buildings in the Home and Great Parks at Windsor, and Hampton Court Mews and Paddocks."

[1] https://www.royal.uk/about-site

[2] https://www.royal.uk/royal-finances-0

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#292

Post by HL33tibCe7 »

gerdesj wrote: post #285
somewhereoutth wrote: post #159

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Or indeed burning a model of the Grenfell Tower at a bonfire party https://www.theguardian.com/uk-news/2018/nov/06/grenfell-bon...

72 people died in the Grenfell Tower tragedy. Why would you do anything apart from express sympathy to the families of the lost? Why did you post that comment?

It was a terrible tragedy, but it’s patently absurd that we should give someone a jail sentence for making a joke about it.

(The jail sentence was suspended, but that’s hardly the point. Any criminal conviction, even a fine, carries the ultimate threat of jail, or, if you resist arrest, even death — all this, for a joke).

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#293

Post by TheCoelacanth »

munk-a wrote: post #179
rtpg wrote: post #164

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I mean… why would the royal family be allowed to “keep” anything in an abolished monarchy? Obviously you should just seize roughly all the property. It’s a product of the State, not the royal family working hard

Maybe? That's a really complicated question honestly - how much of their personal property actually is hereditary wealth and how much is a benefit of their station. I can tell you the answer is neither 0% nor 100% - the royal family (if dethroned) shouldn't be thrown out as paupers and it shouldn't be granted personal control of spaces that enjoy public use. Where precisely that line should be drawn is complicated bu…

It's a complicated question with regards to some of their property. It's not at all complicated with the Crown Estates. That is clearly public property. Otherwise Edward VIII would have kept it when he abdicated.

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#294

Post by vkou »

thrown_22 wrote: post #68
vkou wrote: post #23

Earlier quoted context omitted.

> What I won't get is arrested. You must have missed the summer of love that we had two years ago, when crowds of protesters were regularly beaten and gassed, and often arrested (Charges would, of course, get dropped, because it's not actually illegal to protest.) But you are correct, it's possible to protest the British monarchy as much as you want in the US, with next to consequences. :)

Quoted post unavailable.

https://www.reddit.com/r/Seattle/comments/gy5knm/latest_esca...

The only fire and violence I see in that one is started by the guys in uniform.

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#295

Post by antirlr »

gerdesj wrote: post #273
matthewh806 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see this exact same comment did pretty well on Reddit too: https://www.reddit.com/r/unitedkingdom/comments/xckw5v/comme... 1. Not all of the arrests have been made at a "funeral" 2. It wasn't a funeral 3. If you're going to have a very public precession, parading a body through the streets with all the obedients lapping it up, surely you have to have a level of tolerance for dissenting voices? I imagine the disrupt…

"with all the obedients lapping it up" What exactly is an "obedient"? Are you really deploying a disparaging tag on people who are mourning? That seems a bit crass to me. "we need room for the dissenting voices too" - I saw on C4 (UK TV channel) this evening, some people in Scotland describing their disaffection with the Monarchy. That's fine and quite right. I also find the sheer amount of coverage a bit overwhelmin…

No post body was provided.

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#296

Post by IncRnd »

quadrifoliate wrote: post #278
Havoc wrote: post #76

Earlier quoted context omitted.

>They are being arrested for being rude about it. Which is substantially worse. Rudeness is so subjective and context sensitive that it really shouldn't form the basis for arrests

As an American, it is hard for me to properly grasp the fact that the UK almost seems closer to Saudi Arabia than the US in this regard. It does not seem like having a "fuck imperialism" sign should ever get you arrested in a country that is supposedly one of the closest allies of the US.

The US had a revolution from King George III and created a Constitution with 10 Amendments in order to guard against this exact type of behaviour from the government. Discussion on the subject of the people's rights independent of their government isn't widely held today. Maybe that should change.

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#297

Post by H8crilA »

pessimizer wrote: post #176

This is a great time for the British to have a little revolution with very modest aims like this. Both the government and the opposition are indistinguishable warmongering austerians who hate working people, British energy bills are tripling due to elite adventurism, posturing, and US ass-kissing, and the ex-colonies are openly proposing separating from the Commonwealth. What's more, the Queen alternated between a be…

Lol. The British monarchy is completely irrelevant. It is useful as a target to release some of that social tension, though, like is the case here.

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#298

Post by gerdesj »

HideousKojima wrote: post #56
mc32 wrote: post #40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

But this is a case in the UK. They have different laws and observe different decorum. Even in the US I would think protesting a funeral to be in extremely poor taste, no matter the target. What’s that Latin phrase about the recently dead?

Yeah but the UK is where you can get arrested for making your girlfriend's pug do a Nazi salute as a joke (but somehow Father Ted doing similar Nazi jokes gets a pass)

Citation needed but I suspect you are probably right about the pug.

Father Ted is Irish as in Republic of Ireland as in not UKoGB - we share a very, very strange border. Having said that, Father Ted was turned down by RTE for being too Irish and was eventually financed by the BBC! Thankfully it eventually aired because it is absolutely belting.

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#299

Post by matthewh806 »

gerdesj wrote: post #273
matthewh806 wrote: post #109

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I see this exact same comment did pretty well on Reddit too: https://www.reddit.com/r/unitedkingdom/comments/xckw5v/comme... 1. Not all of the arrests have been made at a "funeral" 2. It wasn't a funeral 3. If you're going to have a very public precession, parading a body through the streets with all the obedients lapping it up, surely you have to have a level of tolerance for dissenting voices? I imagine the disrupt…

"with all the obedients lapping it up" What exactly is an "obedient"? Are you really deploying a disparaging tag on people who are mourning? That seems a bit crass to me. "we need room for the dissenting voices too" - I saw on C4 (UK TV channel) this evening, some people in Scotland describing their disaffection with the Monarchy. That's fine and quite right. I also find the sheer amount of coverage a bit overwhelmin…

> What exactly is an "obedient"? Are you really deploying a disparaging tag on people who are mourning? That seems a bit crass to me.

Yeah, its a crass term I will agree with you there. The public has come out in droves to support the royal family and respect the ongoing proceedings and a small number have vocally voiced their opposition to the situation and are being condemned for doing so. So, I used this charged term rather cheaply to paint with broad strokes the kind of person I imagine to lap up this unique moment.

> I saw on C4 (UK TV channel) this evening, some people in Scotland describing their disaffection with the Monarchy. That's fine and quite right.

Here I also agree with you that its nice to hear that C4 was airing voices of people with dissenting perspectives, but I don't necessarily think it should be confined to the TV or the internet as the "appropriate place" to air such views. I think going out and publicly protesting it is much more impactful

> What exactly do you want?

For people to realise that this isn't just a private occasion for immediate family to pay their respects to the recently departed. That the Royal family, for better or worse, has and continues to play a significant role in the ongoing story of this country and in having such a prominent and public position should be tolerant (even understanding?) of those who oppose, rather than to have it simply be quashed and scrubbed away

Re: Anti-royal protesters are being arrested in the U.K. as 'Not My King' tag grows

#300

Post by HL33tibCe7 »

random_upvoter wrote: post #214

I've been a bit disconcerted at the level of unmitigated adulation that's been showered on the late queen by the media. I have nothing bad to say about Elizabeth II but I too do my job every day -- without a staff of hundreds to prepare my breakfast -- and I don't think I will be sanctified the day I keel over. It's all so serious and deeply conservative you'd think we are back in the 1950. In the 1970s Monty Python…

I like and admire the Queen, but I also wonder about this. How much of our admiration is the result of the British media giving the Queen essentially 100% positive coverage at all times for 70 years straight?

(Unlike politicians, who will be gone in 4 years or so anyway, media outlets are terrified of upsetting the royal family, who are permanent).

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