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Benefits of ‘looping’ kids with teachers for multiple years

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Re: Benefits of ‘looping’ kids with teachers for multiple years

#71

Post by kbenson »

onemoresoop wrote: post #8
lumost wrote: post #3

This seems like a practice that would work for some students and hurt others. Some students may not do well with a particular teacher. Being stuck for years with that teacher is a disservice to the student.

That one student should be able to switch to a different group. If all want to switch then there's a problem with the instructor. Let's look at the opposite end of the spectrum. Student loves an instructor but is needlessly switched to someone new. My point though is that the flexibility to change or stay in the same group should exist.

In this scenario switching is not just getting a different teacher, but an entirely new set of classmates as well, meaning the child is willingly walking away from all their friends and acquaintances they've made possibly over years.

I suspect the vast majority of students will choose to stay with the current teacher, even if a very poor fit for them, because of that.

Re: Benefits of ‘looping’ kids with teachers for multiple years

#72

Post by 8note »

evancoop wrote: post #62
lumost wrote: post #3

This seems like a practice that would work for some students and hurt others. Some students may not do well with a particular teacher. Being stuck for years with that teacher is a disservice to the student.

Seems like, in aggregate, the question is whether adding variance to outcomes is net positive or negative? Some students will receive multiple consecutive years of excellent instruction, others will receive multiple consecutive years of subpar instruction. Does the upside contain innovation and social mobility? Does the downside contain increased disillusionment with school and education broadly? We pull the goalie w…

I had split 3/4 and 5/6 classes, where you stayed with the same teacher and students for both years, with either an older or a younger cohort with you to fill out the other grade

Theres at least one benefit outside of having a good teacher for two years - - the teacher starts the second year with context about your skills and what needs improvement. Eg. They can spend the summer knowing how many students are ahead and plan relevant coursework

The downside was around not interacting with the students who have the other teacher much for a couple years. Much harder to retain those friends

Re: Benefits of ‘looping’ kids with teachers for multiple years

#73

Post by llbeansandrice »

kbenson wrote: post #71
onemoresoop wrote: post #8

Earlier quoted context omitted.

That one student should be able to switch to a different group. If all want to switch then there's a problem with the instructor. Let's look at the opposite end of the spectrum. Student loves an instructor but is needlessly switched to someone new. My point though is that the flexibility to change or stay in the same group should exist.

In this scenario switching is not just getting a different teacher, but an entirely new set of classmates as well, meaning the child is willingly walking away from all their friends and acquaintances they've made possibly over years. I suspect the vast majority of students will choose to stay with the current teacher, even if a very poor fit for them, because of that.

I agree, people struggle to leave jobs with horrible bosses due to other aspects that aren't as big as your friend group and support structure as a child. This sounds awful for those kids.

I suppose there's an argument to be made about "preparing for the 'real world'" but still.

Re: Benefits of ‘looping’ kids with teachers for multiple years

#75

Post by beebmam »

lumost wrote: post #3

This seems like a practice that would work for some students and hurt others. Some students may not do well with a particular teacher. Being stuck for years with that teacher is a disservice to the student.

The less I interacted with teachers, the better I did. Children can differ so much in how they learn best.

Re: Benefits of ‘looping’ kids with teachers for multiple years

#76

Post by omegalulw »

beebmam wrote: post #75
lumost wrote: post #3

This seems like a practice that would work for some students and hurt others. Some students may not do well with a particular teacher. Being stuck for years with that teacher is a disservice to the student.

The less I interacted with teachers, the better I did. Children can differ so much in how they learn best.

I would say that's more of a reflection of your teachers then unless you have a really exceptional style of learning.

Re: Benefits of ‘looping’ kids with teachers for multiple years

#77

Post by sybercecurity »

CliffStoll wrote: post #14

Standard in Waldorf schools. The first-grade teacher follows her/his class all the way up to 8th grade. As the students grow, so does the teacher. All the advantages -- and disadvantages -- that you might imagine.

Common in Montessori schools as well. Children typically spend 3 year "sets" in the same classroom with the same teacher (called "guides" in Montessori though).

Re: Benefits of ‘looping’ kids with teachers for multiple years

#78

Post by lumost »

yamtaddle wrote: post #39
nickff wrote: post #28

Earlier quoted context omitted.

It's probably true; schools are generally run for the benefit and convenience of teachers, not students. The former have a strong union with outsized influence on local elections, whereas the latter don't even vote. The same incentives lead to early school start times which help teachers at the cost of students (particularly teenagers who generally have 'later' circadian rhythms).

> It's probably true; schools are generally run for the benefit and convenience of teachers, not students. This is, emphatically, not even close to true. If someone told you this, they were lying or just had no idea how schools work and were guessing. > early school start times which help teachers at the cost of students A perfect example of how you're veering away from reality with your faulty premise: teachers don'…

like daylight savings, I think everyone feels compelled to pretend there is a reason for this madness.

I don't believe there is any purpose in the current school start time, but it's been this way for ages. I'm sure it works for at least some people - but I don't see any reason why student athletes couldn't practice in the morning and spare the rest of us.

Re: Benefits of ‘looping’ kids with teachers for multiple years

#79

Post by lumost »

8note wrote: post #72
evancoop wrote: post #62

Earlier quoted context omitted.

Seems like, in aggregate, the question is whether adding variance to outcomes is net positive or negative? Some students will receive multiple consecutive years of excellent instruction, others will receive multiple consecutive years of subpar instruction. Does the upside contain innovation and social mobility? Does the downside contain increased disillusionment with school and education broadly? We pull the goalie w…

I had split 3/4 and 5/6 classes, where you stayed with the same teacher and students for both years, with either an older or a younger cohort with you to fill out the other grade Theres at least one benefit outside of having a good teacher for two years - - the teacher starts the second year with context about your skills and what needs improvement. Eg. They can spend the summer knowing how many students are ahead an…

This assumes that the teacher correctly identified what needs improvement, or cares to improve you. Neither of these are given. My recollection of school was that I was often miss-understood by teachers resulting in net-negative interventions. Sometimes I'd be fortunate and click with the right teacher. In aggregate my current success depends heavily on those few times I clicked.
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