Live data from Hacker News

Ubuntu’s move to Unity is the best thing that ever happened to Linux

kumailht.com

31–40 of 112 posts

Re: Ubuntu’s move to Unity is the best thing that ever happened to Linux

#31
post #10

I consider myself power user. I am developer, I have experience with Windows, Mac OS X, BSD OSes and Linuxes. I have actually tried various desktop environments and WMs (including several tiling managers, I have used awesome WM for half a year). Overall I really love experimenting with software to the very deep level. I have tried Unity and I really like it. It is simple and it does what I need. It respects my screen…

Thirded,

Geeks are coding away at some application feature, managing servers, updating designs, watching some TV show, browsing the web, discussing project goals over skype with team members and other mundane things – all this on a slow day.

I disagree. I have three windows open. Google Chrome (with, unfortunately for my productivity, Hacker News open), Emacs, and a Gnome Terminal (I X forward my Emacs session from my home machine to my work machine).

Even if I did have skype open rather than an IRC session (in ERC/irssi), I don't see how Unity is better or worse than the normal Gnome set-up. Alt-Tab still works. Same goes for other applications that are distracting me from my editor.

What part of alt-tabing and application launching does Unity do so terribly compared to the old Gnome interface + Gnome-Do (I hated the menus, I tab-complete in the terminal, why can't I tab-complete in my application launcher?).

Re: Ubuntu’s move to Unity is the best thing that ever happened to Linux

#32
I really want to know how these "non-geeks" are going to get a chance to like Unity. I'm all for bringing Linux closer to people, and looking at the work that Android has done, it clarifies that with a correct marketing and technical drive, Linux' openness is something which can attract a large range of users.

Worth noting that Android for all intents and purposes is fighting a closed, one-device (or at least one brand of device) Apple iOS. Commanding a place on desktops (not sure the relevance of this is still the same) will be arguably a different fight than on the mobile space.

Windows runs on all hardware, its a familiar albeit crappy at times interface. What tells me most that Linux as a viable desktop for non-geeks is a fairytale never going to happen is the fact that right now, apart from a select group of pc vendors, the only way for anyone non-technical to get access to a ubuntu install is to install it themselves.

It doesn't matter if its such a simple install, users are frightened to install a simple application at times.

On this note, I always find it mystifying who all these non-geeks we are trying to appeal to are, I'm all for a slicker, easier to use desktop but why not target it at the market which have stood by and held up Linux for all these years.

Re: Ubuntu’s move to Unity is the best thing that ever happened to Linux

#33
post #10

I consider myself power user. I am developer, I have experience with Windows, Mac OS X, BSD OSes and Linuxes. I have actually tried various desktop environments and WMs (including several tiling managers, I have used awesome WM for half a year). Overall I really love experimenting with software to the very deep level. I have tried Unity and I really like it. It is simple and it does what I need. It respects my screen…

Well for one example: I use 2 large monitors to work with and run allot of applications at the same time. With gnome 2 I can put a seperate taskbar on each monitor and switch quickly between tasks with the keyboard or mouse. I also have another panel with buttons to launch my most common apps. Small amount of mouse movement and 1 click. With unity I have to drag the mouse right to the far left or my furthest left mon…

OK. I see how it can be problem with two monitors but aren't shortcuts like (Start+1) helping in this case? While I still see problem with eyes movement. Lastly I'm against idea using multiple monitors so I don't feel competent enough to comment.

Problem with GUI apps from shell script is bug in my opinion but I was not affected by it yet.

Re: Ubuntu’s move to Unity is the best thing that ever happened to Linux

#34
I have experienced quite the opposite. A lot of colleagues that were once found of Ubuntu switched in flocks to other distros starting with Ubuntu Maverick.

With Ubuntu 11, friends personally asked me how to switch back to the previous system, or to dump linux completely because the system got too slow with updates. And, sadly, that's true: the experience of the Ubuntu desktop, performance-wise, has degraded to the point of being significantly slower than windows xp or 7.

I have witnessed netbooks (decent netbooks running either android or ubuntu with unity) considered as "crap" by several non-tecnical people talking in the building, simply because they don't work "as expected" and thus being almost unuseable by them.

The way I see it, most people expect a standard windows-like interface. I've long stopped being a "go-to guy for computers" so I don't enter these discussions anymore, but that's very sad for me to realize that Ubuntu had everything two years ago for both technical users and new users, while now people simply flock away.

Even at work, I'm seriously considering to dump Ubuntu LTS on servers due to the increasing (unfixed) issues we have on large systems, mostly due to Ubuntu changes compared to debian and/or ubuntu projects such as upstart. Bugs on launchpad (let alone the crappyness that is launchpad itself) don't get fixed, but are simply "waited for" from upstream (either debian or source author).

I'm disappointed, really. Having the choice of the interface would have been so damn easy.

Re: Ubuntu’s move to Unity is the best thing that ever happened to Linux

#35
I'm probably a non-geek by HN standards, I primarily use my computer for internet, writing documents, media consumption etc... I have been using Ubuntu for 5 years or so and for my purposes it is "like windows, but better": (Practically) no viruses, no strange bugs, easy to reinstall/upgrade/backup. Personally I didn't like Unity and the changes at all and I didn't want to bother to learn / get used to it. Which of course is no problem, since Xubuntu works fine for me too.

Where I don't agree with the author is the image of the "average joe". The characterization is possibly correct if you are talking about non-computer literate users ages 40+ or so. But in the age group Firefox/Chrome, MicrosoftOffice->OpenOffice without considering "gloss" at all.

Re: Ubuntu’s move to Unity is the best thing that ever happened to Linux

#37

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I agree, if they had taken advantage of the fact that their competitors are spending lots of resources on simpler OSs for tablets etc and concentrated on providing the best Power User experience out there and spent the time they spent on Unity building really useful software I think there would be more of a business model for them.

I can't contemplate how on earth they might reach tablets either. (Not ones hand-made for 125$, obviously, that one ran Windows anyway).

They have 3 options I think.

1) Get people to jailbreak their tablets and install it. Fair enough but it will be very niche and more of a novelty, will never reach critical mass to get useful commercial apps. Will probably get picked by Chinese manufacturers who will resell cheap tablets with Ubuntu re-themed to look as much like iOS as possible, probably called iBuntu or something.

2) Make deals with manufacturers and produce mass market tablets, they will have to compete head on with android and I'm not sure what their USP would be here. They would either need 100% android compatibility or would need to magic allot of app developers out of thin air.

3) Go exclusively for niche markets, for example selling to car manufacturers developing bespoke in-car entertainment systems. This would be a whole new business strategy for them and would basically remove the need for the "ubuntu project" as it exists today.

Re: Ubuntu’s move to Unity is the best thing that ever happened to Linux

#38
post #16

There are two reasons why an average person learns computers and uses a particular OS: * Even if it is not very intuitive, it is universally used (Windows) * Even if it is not universally used, it is intuitive (Mac OS) Linux is currently, IMHO, in the middle. This brings up a lot of issues from an average Joe's perspective: some hardware configurations do not work perfectly (especially laptops), time spent in learnin…

Regarding an OS being intuitive...my wife is typically the ultimate test. She's not a power user...she just wants to surf the web, process photos, and email. She also has very low tolerance for UX deficiencies.

I've had Windows 7, Ubuntu with Gnome 2, and OSX Snow Leopard and Lion in front of her. She was ok with Windows 7...it was tolerable, but we hit our first virus soon in and I ordered it off the machine. She liked Gnome 2 better, but it took a bit of getting used. Unity was pretty straight-forward for her...she likes it very much and prefers it above all others. OS X, however, was an entirely frustrating experience. I gave her my Macbook Pro because I was using my Lenovo Ubuntu notebook far more often and felt my hard-earned Apple investment was going to waste. She gave it a fair shot but HATED it. OS X's insistence on keeping applications open in the background even after the last window is closed slowly ate up memory. If two users are logged into the system and simply running a web browser and nothing more, the system crawls...no clue why. But the absolute worst part of her experience was the completely obstinate, bizarre OS X window switching and minimizing behavior. I realize many of you are accustomed to it by now, but she still rants about the fact that command-tab won't switch between all windows, and how minimizing a window requires right-clicking the icon to find it. Anyway, I'm sure there are ways to work around this behavior, but it should give one pause when someone calls Mac OS intuitive...I'd argue it's far from it.

Re: Ubuntu’s move to Unity is the best thing that ever happened to Linux

#39
post #10

I consider myself power user. I am developer, I have experience with Windows, Mac OS X, BSD OSes and Linuxes. I have actually tried various desktop environments and WMs (including several tiling managers, I have used awesome WM for half a year). Overall I really love experimenting with software to the very deep level. I have tried Unity and I really like it. It is simple and it does what I need. It respects my screen…

Thirded, Geeks are coding away at some application feature, managing servers, updating designs, watching some TV show, browsing the web, discussing project goals over skype with team members and other mundane things – all this on a slow day. I disagree. I have three windows open. Google Chrome (with, unfortunately for my productivity, Hacker News open), Emacs, and a Gnome Terminal (I X forward my Emacs session from m…

Alt-tab works, but alt-shift-tab does not - or at least did not work for me when I upgraded. Not wanting to waste time looking for a workaround, I just reverted to my backup and forgot about Unity.

Re: Ubuntu’s move to Unity is the best thing that ever happened to Linux

#40

Earlier quoted context omitted.

I can't contemplate how on earth they might reach tablets either. (Not ones hand-made for 125$, obviously, that one ran Windows anyway).

They have 3 options I think. 1) Get people to jailbreak their tablets and install it. Fair enough but it will be very niche and more of a novelty, will never reach critical mass to get useful commercial apps. Will probably get picked by Chinese manufacturers who will resell cheap tablets with Ubuntu re-themed to look as much like iOS as possible, probably called iBuntu or something. 2) Make deals with manufacturers a…

None of these options make what they do now viable.
Post reply on HN